0080 Nitpick

[Kratos]

Just thought of something while watching 0080: Bernie has a short conversation with a Feddie officer about Sydney and Australia. Wouldn't Sydney, y'know, not exist anymore, thanks to Operation British? I could have sworn that I read somewhere that Sydney was within the 16% of the continent that was wiped out. And even if it wasn't, I find it strange that two characters could have a conversation about Australia without bringing up the colony drop at all. So what gives? I haven't seen the MSG movie trilogy in a while, so I don't remember if any specifics on Operation British were given...were the details of the colony drop not established until later, or something?

[Phantomexe87]

I suppose soldiers at Side 6 may not know too much about Earth or its geopolitics, since the war started coverage was probably mixed. I'm more amazed Bernie would even use Sydney, the only way I can see a Zeon even knowing about Sydney, is after hearing their failed colony drop took it out.

[Koshernova]

I seriously doubt an Earth Federation Soldier wouldn't know about the biggest human-created catastrophe to befall the Earth in his time Probably a plot hole. Just like how in Universalcentury.net Gundam Online you had that area of Australia totally intact (and there was no actual ocean around the continent, even...).

[Chris]

This is probably one of those cases where all you can give is a real world explanation. MSG never specified what city was destroyed in Operation British, and I believe that even as late as 1989 (when 0080 was produced) it still hadn't been officially set as Sydney. It's not until two years later with 0083 that we get a reference to Sydney being the city in question.

[toysdream]

This is probably one of those cases where all you can give is a real world explanation. MSG never specified what city was destroyed in Operation British, and I believe that even as late as 1989 (when 0080 was produced) it still hadn't been officially set as Sydney. It's not until two years later with 0083 that we get a reference to Sydney being the city in question.

Actually, this was established in Gundam Century, which subsequent writers pretty much took as holy writ. Perhaps the conversation is meant to be a wistful one about what the weather would be like if Sydney still existed. In fact, claiming you're from Sydney is a pretty good cover story for a spy, since it immediately establishes a credible motive for fighting in the Federation Forces.

-- Mark

[mcred23]

Wouldn't Sydney, y'know, not exist anymore, thanks to Operation British?

As we've already pointed out, Sydney didn't exsist anymore, but I don't see how that would stop Bernie from talking about how the weather might have been had the city still exsisted (And had he actually been from there). Granted, there is a plot hole in the form of nobody batting an eyebrow over a city that was destroyed, but Chris covered that point.

EDIT: And as usual, Marky Mark came in and says what I wanted to, only better.

[Chris]

Actually, this was established in Gundam Century, which subsequent writers pretty much took as holy writ. Perhaps the conversation is meant to be a wistful one about what the weather would be like if Sydney still existed. In fact, claiming you're from Sydney is a pretty good cover story for a spy, since it immediately establishes a credible motive for fighting in the Federation Forces.

-- Mark

Indeed, that was the impression I always got from the conversation. Although I don't have time to check the DVD, I believe that in the English dub Bernie says "This time of year, it'd be all covered in snow." The 'it'd' as in "it would" could certainly represent a nostalgic sentiment of how the weather would be if Sydney was still there. Too bad for Bernie he got his seasons wrong.

[Recon 5]

He could have been referring to the weather at the former location of Sydney. Whether its a thriving metropolis or a crater large enough to fit the whole EFF fleet (and that would still be quite a landmark so most people would know the location, even those born after British) wouldn't exactly affect the climate there.

[Kratos]

Whether its a thriving metropolis or a crater large enough to fit the whole EFF fleet wouldn't exactly affect the climate there.

Sure it would. Something that massive slamming into the Earth at a high enough speed to create a 500 km crater would almost certainly result in enough debris to radically change the weather of the affected area.

[Ryujin]

He could have been referring to the weather at the former location of Sydney. Whether its a thriving metropolis or a crater large enough to fit the whole EFF fleet (and that would still be quite a landmark so most people would know the location, even those born after British) wouldn't exactly affect the climate there.

Um, Australia's in the Southern Hemisphere. Winter starts in June, Summer starts in December. Bernie got it waaaay wrong.

[Recon 5]

Well, I think that settles it. He was wrong about the weather so he could have been wrong about the city still existing (or perhaps the climate did change, from the conditions we'd expect today to those he stated, due to the effects of the colony drop). Either way, its case closed in my opinion.

[Draco Starcloud]

Good thing for Bernie that the Feddie didn't seem to know any more about Australia's seasons than he did.

[Black Knight]

Bernie messing up the season was, you know, deliberate? On the part of the writing staff, that is. It's what allowed that Feddie soldier to realize Bernie was a Zeon spy, thus foiling the Cyclops Team's infiltration and attempt to steal the Alex?

Sydney only came up because the Feddie was curious about Bernie's accent, and asked if it was Australian, to which Bernie agreed, but then extemporized the idea that in December Sydney would have snow, which, because Australia is in the southern hemisphere, wouldn't happen.

This was the very believable way 0080's writers decided to have the Cyclops Team get discovered. Bernie not realizing what season it would be in Australia was done on purpose.

[Chris]

Well, I think that settles it. He was wrong about the weather so he could have been wrong about the city still existing (or perhaps the climate did change, from the conditions we'd expect today to those he stated, due to the effects of the colony drop). Either way, its case closed in my opinion.

I really can't buy this "didn't know about Sydney" thing that people keep throwing around. How could anyone NOT know about the defining first moment of the One Year War, especially a Zeon soldier? The same goes for the Federation soldiers too. It's like saying there's an American soldier who didn't know about 9/11 months after it happened.

[Kratos]

Bernie messing up the season was, you know, deliberate? On the part of the writing staff, that is. It's what allowed that Feddie soldier to realize Bernie was a Zeon spy, thus foiling the Cyclops Team's infiltration and attempt to steal the Alex?

Sydney only came up because the Feddie was curious about Bernie's accent, and asked if it was Australian, to which Bernie agreed, but then extemporized the idea that in December Sydney would have snow, which, because Australia is in the southern hemisphere, wouldn't happen.

This was the very believable way 0080's writers decided to have the Cyclops Team get discovered. Bernie not realizing what season it would be in Australia was done on purpose.

But that isn't the issue. The issue is that Sydney was mentioned at all, as it was destroyed in the colony drop of Operation British, and it seems strange (at least to me) that such a catastrophe wouldn't be touched upon even in brief in a conversation about the city. This was done because, in the real world, Sydney had yet to be established as the city hit by the colony. As Mark said, the best in-universe explanation is probably that Bernie was reflecting nostalgically upon what the weather in Sydney WOULD be like if circumstances were different, but even that seems kinda flimsy....to continue with Chris' analogy, one does not mention the Twin Towers nowadays without bringing up 9/11.

Then again, I suppose you could always assume that Zeon military grunts didn't learn the full details about the outcome of Operation British, and so Bernie had a reason not to know about Sydney's destruction. But there is no way a Federation officer wouldn't know about it.

[toysdream]

This was done because, in the real world, Sydney had yet to be established as the city hit by the colony.

Not so. As I noted above, this had been established ten years earlier by Gundam Century, the de facto bible of the Gundam universe.

As Mark said, the best in-universe explanation is probably that Bernie was reflecting nostalgically upon what the weather in Sydney WOULD be like if circumstances were different, but even that seems kinda flimsy....to continue with Chris' analogy, one does not mention the Twin Towers nowadays without bringing up 9/11.

It's brought up by implication, but it's hardly necessary to spell it out. You'd never hear somebody say "I miss the cherry trees of Hiroshima... You know, the city in Japan? That was destroyed by an atomic bomb? Back in World War II? That Hiroshima." And that was sixty years ago, not eleven months.

Likewise, in the Gundam universe, you'll often see people mention places like Colony 30 and Junius Seven without adding a bunch of exposition about what happened there. That's not a mistake by the writers, just an attempt at realistic dialogue.

-- Mark

[Dave]

He could have been referring to the weather at the former location of Sydney. Whether its a thriving metropolis or a crater large enough to fit the whole EFF fleet (and that would still be quite a landmark so most people would know the location, even those born after British) wouldn't exactly affect the climate there.

Um, Australia's in the Southern Hemisphere. Winter starts in June, Summer starts in December. Bernie got it waaaay wrong.

Maybe they don't teach Earth geography in Zeo schools and so he used that city as his home because he heard about the colony drop.





That's alway been my theory

[NewtypeS3]

Um, Australia's in the Southern Hemisphere. Winter starts in June, Summer starts in December. Bernie got it waaaay wrong.

Maybe they don't teach Earth geography in Zeo schools and so he used that city as his home because he heard about the colony drop.
That's alway been my theory

From what I recall, though, the Space Colonies are all based off the Hemisphere with the most population for their seasonal schedule: the Northern Hemisphere. Having lived on Colonies assumedly most of his life, it'd be hard to remember that the Southern Hemisphere does it differently.
Hell, there are many adults in the real world who still don't know that.

[Albireo_818]

[
From what I recall, though, the Space Colonies are all based off the Hemisphere with the most population for their seasonal schedule: the Northern Hemisphere. Having lived on Colonies assumedly most of his life, it'd be hard to remember that the Southern Hemisphere does it differently.
Hell, there are many adults in the real world who still don't know that.

He;;, you wouldnt beleive the amount of Americans and British i've met that are like that (I'm Aussie, btw). Amen to that Newtype

[ZeonfromHell]

Whether its a thriving metropolis or a crater large enough to fit the whole EFF fleet wouldn't exactly affect the climate there.

Sure it would. Something that massive slamming into the Earth at a high enough speed to create a 500 km crater would almost certainly result in enough debris to radically change the weather of the affected area.

Not to mention the massive heat effects from a thermonuclear explosion, and the fact that all that mass glowing red from atmospheric re-entry. The heat alone from that would alter the climate, let alone the effects from the explosion.