Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

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doghunter1
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Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

Warning: Some questions veer onto Mecha and Technology, but please don't move this thread there. Questions might be part of the worldbuilding.

Now that that's settled, here goes:

1. Is it true the Tieren uses gas as a power source as opposed to Union Realdos and AEU Hellions?

2. Is it true that at one point, Iran was called Azadistan, with its capital at Tabriz, and that, unlike real life (if it's true at all), it stayed that way by the 2300s?

3. Is "Havely" even an actual Spanish surname?
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HellCat
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

It's Halevy, not Havely.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

doghunter1 wrote:Warning: Some questions veer onto Mecha and Technology, but please don't move this thread there. Questions might be part of the worldbuilding.

Now that that's settled, here goes:

1. Is it true the Tieren uses gas as a power source as opposed to Union Realdos and AEU Hellions?

2. Is it true that at one point, Iran was called Azadistan, with its capital at Tabriz, and that, unlike real life (if it's true at all), it stayed that way by the 2300s?

3. Is "Havely" even an actual Spanish surname?
1. I have no idea, although it seems very unlikely AFAIK. The use - or rather, the non-use of fossil fuels is what sparked the Solar Power Wars, and it seems to me extremely unlikely that a nation that has access to the solar power generation system would continue to depend on a fossil fuel-powered unit.
That being said, it is less advanced than either the AEU or the Union's machines - notably the AEU Enact, which while being established as a ripoff of the Flag, does have the ability IIRC to draw energy directly from the orbital elevator.

2. I can't speak to that; It IS true that "Azadistan" was the name of a short-lived Republic established in a single province of Iran - Azerbaijan. And when I say "short-lived" I mean it lasted less than a year. It is also true that geographically, Azadistan is located in what we know as Iran. So it is not unreasonable to assume that a nation using the same name could have sprung up in that region. HOWEVER, remember that in 00, Azadistan is a constitutional monarchy rather than a republic-type government, so it seems farfetched to assume they are one and the same.
(On a related note, many - myself included - have posited that "Krugis" may be a corrupted form of a word referring to the Kurdish tribe of roughly the same region)

3. AFAIK, "Halevy" is not Spanish, period. "Halévy", with an accented "e", is actually a surname borne by a number of French historical figures, including a composer, a couple of historians, and a couple of authors. From what I've been able to find (and allow me to stress that I am speculating here), it may be related to the Hebrew "Halevi"( or "ha-Levi"), which seems to be derived from the given name Levi, possibly in reference to the Biblical Tribe of Levi.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

doghunter1 wrote:1. Is it true the Tieren uses gas as a power source as opposed to Union Realdos and AEU Hellions?
The Tieren does not run off fossil fuels. Its predecessor the Fanton and its export version Anf have fossil fuel based engines.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

doghunter1 wrote:Warning: Some questions veer onto Mecha and Technology, but please don't move this thread there. Questions might be part of the worldbuilding.

Now that that's settled, here goes:

1. Is it true the Tieren uses gas as a power source as opposed to Union Realdos and AEU Hellions?

2. Is it true that at one point, Iran was called Azadistan, with its capital at Tabriz, and that, unlike real life (if it's true at all), it stayed that way by the 2300s?

3. Is "Havely" even an actual Spanish surname?
1) The Tieren's energy source has never been clarified. I honestly won't be surprised if they just run off electricity but given how the blocs are very anti fossil fuels, it's extremely unlikely they'll run on gas.

However of some interesting note is that one of the 00N chapters Anfs or Fantons (I couldn't remember which one was specified) have a "chemical engine" variant for models that are exported outside the Middle East. Presumably this is done because fossil fuels are rare outside the Middle East by this time. In no way does this confirm that the Tieren uses one, but the Anfs and Fanton are similar to the Tierens out of all the other mobile suits so it's one possibility to consider.

Of course, the Flags use hydrogen as their main fuel source so that's always another possibility but that's also for its jet engines.

2) I guess it's better to assume that it's not especially since as mentioned by the above poster that Azadistan is a constitutional monarchy.

However something is interesting on that note. Azadistan used to have a monarchy at some point but they actually lost power and.....well Azadistan stopped having one. In fact, Marina was actually part of the old monarchy's bloodline but the monarchy was recently revived with her placed as a figurehead so she can help unite and stabalize the country. She was actually just a normal girl at some point and her dream was to become a singer.

It should be noted that when it comes to the Middle East, Gundam 00 tends to fictionalization the nations and names. None of the nations are real in our worldand I heard that they even changed the katakana/hiragana word for mosque into something different (this happened around episode 12 and 13, which took place in Azadistan). With this in mind, it's probably best to assume its a different country than the one that used to exist in real life. Then again, it's the future and as Azadistan annexed Krugis in the show, this type of thing probably happened a lot over the centuries.

Also, there's apparently a huge religious divide in Azadistan, with different sects according to the novel (in Gundam 00's case at least, generally a trustworthy grey-level source) with it being mostly different interpretations of the holy book or something. They also divide alongside the Conservatives and Reformists, the factions we saw in the anime. Might be useful information for world building the region.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

Forgot where I have read it, but the Middle East has been unstable since the Oil embrago and Solar Wars that no country last for a long time. The landscape is always changing; countries dissolve or gets taken in by neighbour country.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

1. My theory, since some of its variants has water tank as propellant tank, hydrogen engine sound good. Something like fictional Water-fuelled Car.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

1.) Anf is said to run on gas, as I recall.

2.) ???

3.) Halevy doesn't have to be a Spanish surname for her family to be based in Spain in 2307 A.D. Given concepts of inter-marriage, immigrants, and almost 300 years of time beyond our own, anything is possible, especially for the course of a single family. New names pop up or are altered all the time, and that's not uncommon for surnames internationally, as well, if we take the last few 100 years as an example.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

LightningCount wrote:1.) Anf is said to run on gas, as I recall.

2.) ???

3.) Halevy doesn't have to be a Spanish surname for her family to be based in Spain in 2307 A.D. Given concepts of inter-marriage, immigrants, and almost 300 years of time beyond our own, anything is possible, especially for the course of a single family. New names pop up or are altered all the time, and that's uncommon for surnames internationally, as well, if we take the last few 100 years as an example.

1) I don't think they ever specifically said it was petrol/gasoline, but they did say it run on fossil fuels so it would be one of the possibilities among other things like natural gas and coal.

3) Definitely things are quite globalized now as you said. Crossroad definitely isn't a Japanese name.
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Kyuzo Aoi
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

There was also a possibility that Louise is this:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... uslyJewish

Also noted, how the Union, HRL, and the AEU came to being?
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SonicSP
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

Kyuzo Aoi wrote:There was also a possibility that Louise is this:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... uslyJewish

Also noted, how the Union, HRL, and the AEU came to being?
Part of it is Celestial Being's manipulation via Veda if I'm not mistaken. I'll have to re-check my archives but I believe the 00 World Report book may have said one or two things to say about this if memory serves.

But it's also because of the energy crisis. Basically the blocs are countries that banded together to finance the Orbital Elevator projects, because the endeavor is too much for any one country. It's not a short term project too since the project took maybe 50 years to do and a lot of financing before any benefits could be reaped. Some paragraphs from Gundam 00 Novel 1 talked about this and the information I noted on this paragraph came from there (from memory anyways, I'll go take a peek later at the book and see whether there any more)

Also note that the Solar Energy System and the Orbital Elevators that are used in the series was made by him. So Celestial Being did quite a number to manipulate the world to become as he envisioned it; as was part of the plan. It's sometimes hard to know what parts are Celestial Being's manipulation and what parts are natural occurrences but I reckon something just happens and Celestial Being just accelerates or manipulates them towards a requirement of the plan. Celestial Being is quite influential to say the least because of Veda and their supporters.

I can't remember where this is from specifically but the Cold War fought by the blocs at the start of the series was also a predicted byproduct of the blocs creations (so the Solar Energy System is made and a great energy source was acquired; which is hard if not impossible without the blocs' existences) and the combat intervention phase was to unite the world into a single government.

The next phase after that would be to begin humanity's Innovation also stated as Phase 2. Phase 3 is humanity's migration to space and the Dialogues to Come. (all info in this paragraph was mentioned in Tieria's Monologue that came in a booklet with the final columns of Season 2 Japanese DVDs)
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

I think people might be trying a little to hard to find logic or consistency in Gundam naming schemes...don't recall people getting into these kinds of etymology debates over characters like South Burning or Gemon Bajack.
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SonicSP
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

Was doing some reading and found this:

"HRL also produce anf with engines that uses chemical reaction fuel as fossil fuel is not easy obtain outside ME. High number of newly produce anf uses such engine." - 00N Chapter 6; translation credits goes to the eternally awesome E08

This is a little different than what I said earlier since not only they are "chemical engine" Anfs, but they're modded by the HRL for the purpose of being used normally because fossil fuels are rare outside the Middle East.

One interesting possibility there is the possibility that the Anfs are retrofitted with more modern engine that may be similar to what is used in the rest of the HRL army. It would make sense to streamline your engine fuel types afterall. The HRL has a reputation for this with MS since they like to make one design and make dozens of variants on it to streamline their Maintanence and engineering familiarity process (Tieren AntiAir Cannon 00V chapter). This is the type of thinking that contributes to stuff like Tieren's having five times less mechanical failure rates than the Flags and Enacts, despite being ten years old (same chapter).

This doesn't really confirm that Tieren uses a "chemical engine" but given their philosophy and this modded example, it does make it the best candidate as far as speculation goes. That this is the way all new Anfs are manufactured also seems to suggest its some sort of newer technology of sorts.

Hydrogen is most likely use for the some Tieren variant's propulsion systems like the High Mobility II and the Space Type given what the stuff releases looks like as noted in this thread before but I'm beginning to thinki this "chemical engine" thing powers the main systems.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

The same 00N chapter indicated that Tieren runs on electrical power.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

E08 wrote:The same 00N chapter indicated that Tieren runs on electrical power.
There you go. Confirmation right there. I've been wondering for years myself.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

AmuroNT1 wrote:I think people might be trying a little to hard to find logic or consistency in Gundam naming schemes...don't recall people getting into these kinds of etymology debates over characters like South Burning or Gemon Bajack.
Well, to be fair, part of that is inspired by 00 having clearly tried harder to draw a line from our modern world to a spacefaring civilization in the near future, which Gundam has always purported to have but has generally made very little effort in detailing.

Not to say 00 is the best framework, as such, but the effort it puts in does inspire and deserve more questions.

As for the questions...

2) Iran, itself, has changed significantly over the centuries, with its most recent incarnation being about as old as Gundam, itself. Since history is a line of evolutions, rather than a climb to some predetermined pinnacle of perfection, it's entirely possible to see countries shift borders, alter their ethnic makeup, internal stability, and governmental styles. One thing the series gets right, though, is that Persia (owing to its mountainous borders and long, distinct history) will probably be on the short list of nations we'll see 300 years from now.

3) As we speak, Spain has a very large immigrant population from Eastern Europe, and has attracted immigrants since its ascendance under the Catholic Kings and Emperor Carlos. For example, Carlos's reign included all Hapsburg territories in Germany, the Netherlands, Southern Italy, and the Duchy of Milan, never mind the lion's share of the New World. So, you could say the entire existence of Spain (as opposed to Castile and Aragon, as separate entities) has been cosmopolitan and has attracted many different peoples to itself. And that was before the EU.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

SonicSP wrote:
E08 wrote:The same 00N chapter indicated that Tieren runs on electrical power.
There you go. Confirmation right there. I've been wondering for years myself.
The question that should be asked is "What is used to produce the electricity?" Enacts collect power to a battery/capacitor from the Solar Energy System. Flags use a type of hydrogen-engine (hydrogen combustion, hydrogen fuel cell, or something else). Because all mechs are using electricity, but what is producing that electricity?
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

If it's C.E, I alway choose hamsters, genetic engineered hamster :mrgreen: .

But for Tieren, I still stick to previous statement, it's Water-fuelled Mech.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

azrael wrote:
SonicSP wrote:
E08 wrote:The same 00N chapter indicated that Tieren runs on electrical power.
There you go. Confirmation right there. I've been wondering for years myself.
The question that should be asked is "What is used to produce the electricity?" Enacts collect power to a battery/capacitor from the Solar Energy System. Flags use a type of hydrogen-engine (hydrogen combustion, hydrogen fuel cell, or something else). Because all mechs are using electricity, but what is producing that electricity?
The Flags also possess a Solar Energy System, but they rarely use it because most of their missions are deployed outside Union territory. That means they're also capable of electricity converted from thee energy they receive from the SES.

The Flags use hydrogen as the fuel source for their four jet engines, I believe the HG Flag states this. I am not sure where they get their electricity when they're not using their SES. The Enact also uses a type of stored fuel for its jets but it's never stated what it is. The Enact's fuel tank is located at its back (00N 1) while the Flags store hydrogen within their E-Carbon armor; by placing a hydrogen atom onto the empty space of a carbon molecule (HG Flag).

=====

We can rule Solar Energy System out for now, the Tierens have not been stated to be a solar energy suit like the Flags and Enacts have been. My guess at the moment is that the Tierens use electrical capacitors like Tau Drive suits do. I guess it's like an electric car.

Based on how 00 likes to elaborate on its mobile weapons fuel sources, usually when they cite a type of energy that an MS uses, they usually refer to the base energy. Pretty much all MS use electricity as you said so if they cite it as electricity as an energy source, that would probably mean that that's the base energy source based on 00 precedents. It's not just 00 in general but also this particular chapter of 00N. The same chapter has noted that the primary energy source of the Anfs have been fossil fuels and some type of chemical (both being seperate variants of each other). So I guess it's likely it's calling out the primary energy source of the Tieren's too.

To use an example, the Anfs have been stated from at least two source to use a fossil fuel engine (the primary fuel source stated right there) and it's super likely to have electronics and use electricity. Based on the info, we conclude that fossil fuel is the primary source of energy. I interpret E08's comment earlier stating that the Tieren runs on an engine that sources energy from electricity just like the Anf runs in an engine that sources energy from fossil fuels.

Of course, if we accept the premise that Enacts and Flags can harness their propulsion fuel source to convert into electricity for their systems, then it's likely that Tierens with a propulsion system would be able to do the same thing. Some variants like the High Mobilty and the Space Type possess a propulsion system. I would guess that these variants would have the ability to convert their propulsion fuel into electricity. The Tieren Ground Type lacks a propulsion system so I reckon it runs on an electrical capacitor alone.
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Re: Anno Domini (Gundam 00) worldbuilding questions

For those who answered Questions 1-2, thanks.

New questions:

1. Where is it mentioned Allelujah was originally Chinese-Russian, but got retconned into being Kazakh?

2. Where is it mentioned the reason the KPSA bombed Ireland (thus orphaning the Dylandy twins) because of the AEU placing sanctions on Krugis?

3. Throughout Season 1, how come Saji didn't inquire on Setsuna having parents? I mean, Setsuna and Saji are a year apart, with the latter a year older than the former, so shouldn't he have been alarmed with the fact his neighbor lives by himself?
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