Masamune Shirow

[Nikkolas]

The (in)famous creator of popular manga series Appleseed and of course Ghost in the Shell which would both go on to multiple animated adaptations, the latter of which being cited as both classics in anime film and anime television.

Being an anime fan, I have of course heard of Ghost in the Shell for years and years now. But, just like Gundam, I never had much interest in it until recently. However, in a topic I made about it elsewhere, a poster was kind enough to not only give me the "breakdown" of all GITS incarnations, he also threw in a summary of Appleseed and all its incarnations. And so GITS is back on the backburner because I thought Appleseed sounded a lot more interesting.

I just got all 4 volumes of it from Dark Horse's Digital website and I'm gonna be using it to entertain me for the next few weeks since my internet will be off after the 12th. (kinda broke, unfortunately)

I added the "in" because apparently a lot of people take issue with Mr. Shirow doing porn. I...really couldn't care less. If I had any actual talent, I'd be more than happy to just draw a lot of boobs and make money that way instead of working on all the stuff that went into Appleseed and GITS. Imagine the effort he must have put into detailing not only the art, but researching all this stuff.

Anyway, I suppose in this day and age the anime adaptations of his work are far more well-known than the actaul manga. Ghost in the Shell in particular has eclipsed the manga it seems to the point most people say said manga isn't even worth it. I guess because the main character is fun and enjoyable instead of Ms. Seriousness?

What do you all think? What works of his have you read? How would you compare his source material to the adaptations? I'm also curious about Orion, which sounds delightfully insane.

[LightningCount]

I have mixed feelings about Shirow, partially for some of the reasons you gave, partially because of my limited experience with the source material, and partially because I have a hard time forming a human connection with his characters more often than not--either they're too stoic or they're too goofy. However, he has an amazing imagination and is an immensely skilled designer.

One thing I've noticed, having sampled or seen a number of his works, is that he sort of repeats the same sort of story over and over again with slightly different angles. One could say that Appleseed is the military version of Ghost in the Shell and that Tank Police is the low-tech version of Ghost in the Shell.

Anyway, I too have heard that Appleseed is his best work. I have not read any of the manga on this. However, the original animated feature I was underwhelmed by, and all of the follow-ups were so much CG that I didn't find them appealing enough to give a try. I really would have loved to seen Appleseed get the treatment that GitS did in animation if it is truly his best work.

I have seen the Black Magic M-66 OVA, not manga, which is Shirow's take on Terminator. It has some entertaining sequences and animation, but that's about it. There are things in here that seem to remind me of other works of his, but I forget what they are right now.

Ghost in the Shell has obviously become his most popular work commercially, and I have a history of mixed reaction to it, as well.

I have skimmed through copies of two of his Ghost in the Shell mangas, the Original and Man-Machine Interface. The tone ranges from super goofy to super technical/philosophical, with just a pinch of action between events. Shirow's GitS visual style from the manga seems to have been most accurately captured in the Playstation 1 video game adaptation, which had anime cut scenes between missions.

The original movie is one of the best animated features you'll ever find in terms of visuals, and it follows a number of elements of the original manga, but it is far more serious, philosophical, and stoic in tone. I haven't seen it in a long time, but it didn't really move me outside of its quality. Nevertheless, it is a landmark film. In terms of character designs, it probably is the most different from its source material.

The sequel movie, Innocence, I saw in theaters subbed, and I found it confusing and pretty boring. It tries to follow the first film in style and tone.

Honestly, I didn't really give much credit to GitS until Stand Alone Complex, which tried to merge/balance out the elements of its source material and spinoff works. It made me perhaps a casual fan, I suppose. Ultimately, to the hardcore GitS fan, I think it comes off as an expanded but cheap imitation of the first movie, but despite taking a long time to win me over, over the years, while I don't love it, I have to admit that it is an entertaining, memorable series. It might be in the top ten of anime released in the 2000s in terms of how it stands out from a lot of the crowd.

Stand Alone Complex Season 1 seems to have a little more variety than Season 2 (known as SAC: 2nd Gig), and while both can plod, both provide a lot of interesting stories that can be stand-alone and/or overarching. (Some episodes are single cases, while others connect to a larger plot). With a whole series, the characters get to define themselves more. I still am not a big fan of the lead overall, but the supporting cast really balances out her personality, and there is an interesting enough flow to the cases, along with a few that really stand out from the crowd. This continuity ends with the movie Solid State Society, which is a fine enough curtail call, though not necessarily spectacular, as I recall. It feels like SAC's take on the original movie.

I always wished they'd do a little more with the characters, and sometimes it feels like it goes in for too much shock value, but all and all, it's probably the version of GitS I relate to the most. It is extremely well dubbed, too.

The last series to date is still ongoing. It's called Arise. It is trying to be a restart of the series, like SAC was, but delving deeper into a possible past for the characters. From what I've seen in trailers, it doesn't appear to be a dramatic change from SAC in tone or material overall, despite the intentions to make the series connect with a new generation/audience; however, it does seem to be getting a lot of backlash, especially from fans who only grew up with SAC. Time will tell how that turns out. It's an OVA series like Gundam Unicorn, and only two episodes have been released so far. It is expected to get a dub release, but right now it is only subbed.

EDIT: It is worth noting that GitS as a whole is probably one of the most socially relevant sci-fi series out there in terms of dealing with how cybernetics will affect the world going forward. While there have been many copycats, and it took some of its base ideas from old sci-fi, GitS was on the whole very ahead of its time.

I think Shirow's last main work that I'm familiar with is Dominion Tank Police. I've seen all of the first season, and part of the second season. The first season has a more sci-fi tone and is more carefully animated overall, but it has a really goofy feel and a really bizarre plot. Season 2 seems a little more level-headed and relatable, but isn't anything to write home about yet.

[Zeonista]

I do like Shirow as a manga artist and direct creator the most, when his stories and their interesting, down-to-earth characters can speak directly to me without an animation studio filter. That's not to blame anime really; Shirow is a visionary, and his ideas are barely contained by the manga, let alone the defined limits of animation. He has had the most impact of any mangaka in Japanese SF, and maybe any type of manga, in the world. He was one of the first big names to get translated and brought to America, and his influence has cast a long shadow over contemporary science fiction over here. Nothing very direct, but the Shirow influence has definitely made itself felt in comics, video games, and role-playing games. Movies & TV series have been coy about it, but Shirow's version of the future networked society has become a paradigm of its own, especially among all the people creating and innovating upon our own networked society right now. His version of future events seems a lot more plausible & probable right now than Gundam or Macross or even Star Trek!

Animation-wise, i have been the most disappointed of anime regarding his works compared to any other. Maybe because I have such high expectations, maybe because of Shirow's own OCD concerning visual detail & 3D animation, maybe because the Eighties' anime industry was not especially kind to him and made him wary. Then again, none of his works have ever had the Full Metal Alchemist situation either. I guess it works out in the end... I can honestly recommend Black Magic M-66, because Shirow was part of the production staff, and it improved on his original visuals without losing the story. The 2 Dominion: Tank Police anime series are good because they had story input from him, and fill in gaps in that story universe timeline. GitS: Stand Alone Complex & Second Gig are the best adaptation of the Ghost in the Shell manga. The anime is longer and has more story details, but the original manga themes and characterizations are intact. I am not too thrilled with the current GitS series, mostly because I miss his unique character design, and because it lacks his selectively-judgmental observations on the future imperfect.

[manwiththemachinegun]

Appleseed is awesome, I don't know why it never got the popularity that GitS did. Way less philosophizing, more action and fun characters. If you want to see why people like Shirow, read Appleseed first.

[teslashark]

Might sound lewd, but which of his doujin-ish booklets had the most fighting?