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 Post subject: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:58 pm 
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Cardboard Leo Ace
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Did a thread search and didn't find any topics about it, surprisingly.

Has anyone been keeping up with Zeonic's scanlations? I personally like that they're using a lot of the script from the dub, I thought some of the lines were written pretty well.

But about the manga: I'm liking the art, but the pacing is way off. I feel like it's being made with the assumption that everyone reading it has already seen the series (and recently) so the storytelling is disjointed and awkward. Like a recap episode more than the actual "retelling" that it's supposed to be. I'd like to see the artist slow down and take some time with the characters the way Yaz did with The Origin.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:59 pm 
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It... kind of is, though. It's taking bits and pieces of history developed through After Colony's side material and expanding upon the story present in the TV series while retconning/shifting around a few details here and there in order to help the story make more sense.

I think the pacing's fine, really. Still waiting for Zeonic to actually release Volume 2, myself.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:18 pm 
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Everything is about to be derailed with volume 2 :lol: The story is taking a really weird turn, or rather has been, since Sumizawa introduced a new backstory/twist.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:40 pm 
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Deacon Blues wrote:
Everything is about to be derailed with volume 2 :lol: The story is taking a really weird turn, or rather has been, since Sumizawa introduced a new backstory/twist.


Uh oh, I'm getting excited. Any dates for your next release?

If this story is going to diverge from the anime, then maybe these first issues really are just a recap to get to the good stuff. Hopefully it's better than what Frozen Teardrop is doing :)


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:50 am 
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Just finished reading Vol 2. (Thanks Deacon!)

Rather odd things happen and yet the familiar is there sorta. But some things just made me go wtf.

Spoiler: show
-So how exactly does the Gundanium Alloy thats being transported to Treize (for none other than the Epyon. But is also the same transport from Ep 4) manage to survive a shot from Wing Gundam's Buster Rifle in its raw form, yet a Virgo can't? >_<
-What the heck did Heero use it for anyway?
-The Tallgeese Zi-Long. I never read Episode Zero other than summeries, but i thought it was an exact copy of the original. Oh well im guessing they probably had Katoki make it "different" but a Tallgeese is still just a larger Leo with a mask faceplate over the square screen eyes. At least theres a nice "scope" on the Dober Gun.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:01 am 
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I'm not sure if my rendition for that name is correct. The name is 始龍 (シロン) if memory serves me. I can't remember Chinese to save my life so I to the shi to be zi and the ron to be long. 0_o;


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:57 am 
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Spoiler: show
Raiden wrote:
-So how exactly does the Gundanium Alloy thats being transported to Treize (for none other than the Epyon. But is also the same transport from Ep 4) manage to survive a shot from Wing Gundam's Buster Rifle in its raw form, yet a Virgo can't? >_<


I suppose there is 2 possibilities..
1) The transport absorbs majority of the beam or
2)The explosion of the transport reduces the beam power

In both cases, the gundanium alloy only receive a small doses of beam that does not damage it.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:02 pm 
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Deacon Blues wrote:
I'm not sure if my rendition for that name is correct. The name is 始龍 (シロン) if memory serves me. I can't remember Chinese to save my life so I to the shi to be zi and the ron to be long. 0_o;

Use this
http://www.purpleculture.net/chinese-pinyin-converter/

Should be "Shilong"


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:43 pm 
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Raiden wrote:
Just finished reading Vol 2. (Thanks Deacon!)

Rather odd things happen and yet the familiar is there sorta. But some things just made me go wtf.

Spoiler: show
-So how exactly does the Gundanium Alloy thats being transported to Treize (for none other than the Epyon. But is also the same transport from Ep 4) manage to survive a shot from Wing Gundam's Buster Rifle in its raw form, yet a Virgo can't? >_<
-What the heck did Heero use it for anyway?
-The Tallgeese Zi-Long. I never read Episode Zero other than summeries, but i thought it was an exact copy of the original. Oh well im guessing they probably had Katoki make it "different" but a Tallgeese is still just a larger Leo with a mask faceplate over the square screen eyes. At least theres a nice "scope" on the Dober Gun.


All things considered, I very much liked Volume 2. Some nice new twists.

Spoiler: show
-The transport took the bulk of the damage, while the Gundanium onboard took the residual.
-To complete the Wing Gundam's repairs, most likely. Or... to craft some sort of new equipment?


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:42 am 
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Raiden wrote:
Just finished reading Vol 2. (Thanks Deacon!)

Rather odd things happen and yet the familiar is there sorta. But some things just made me go wtf.

Spoiler: show
-So how exactly does the Gundanium Alloy thats being transported to Treize (for none other than the Epyon. But is also the same transport from Ep 4) manage to survive a shot from Wing Gundam's Buster Rifle in its raw form, yet a Virgo can't? >_<


Spoiler: show
IIRC Didn't Heero intentionally missed hitting the shuttle carrying the Gundanium and just let the plasma vortex destroy the shuttle? I may be wrong though.
And according to the recent MG Wing manual which was actually translated in the Wing Mechanics Questions thread, only Gundanium(or high-powered magnetic anti-field weaponry like the Planet defensors) could withstand the attack. Probably a retcon if you think about it and it was used in this chapter.


In the anime, didn't Heero just outright destroyed the transport along with the gundanium?

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:17 pm 
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Spoiler: show
Presumably this is just the author patching up the slight plothole of exactly where Treize got the Gundanium he used to make Epyon...on the other hand, it seems to open up ANOTHER plothole: how did OZ learn the procedure for making Gundanium that early? At least later in the series it could be justified with the existence of Mercurius and Vayeate, but if they had it all along it raises the question of why they never used it.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:41 pm 
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AmuroNT1 wrote:
Spoiler: show
Presumably this is just the author patching up the slight plothole of exactly where Treize got the Gundanium he used to make Epyon...on the other hand, it seems to open up ANOTHER plothole: how did OZ learn the procedure for making Gundanium that early? At least later in the series it could be justified with the existence of Mercurius and Vayeate, but if they had it all along it raises the question of why they never used it.

Spoiler: show
Well, they probably had the knowledge, but not the manufacturing capabilities. Aside from Epyon and the rebuilt Wing, all the Gundanium-armoured MS we see in the series are assembled in space. IIRC, it's been established that Gundanium has to be manufactured in microgravity - presumably the costs involved in setting up an extraterrestrial assembly facility, producing the Gundanium, and shipping the resulting to Earth were prohibitive, prior to Lady Une's sweet-talking of the Colonies? After all, the Alliance military needed enough MS to operate across the entire Earth Sphere, so the sheer amount of Gundanium they'd need for all those Leos probably put off the UESA beancounters :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:04 pm 
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Dendrobium Stamen wrote:
AmuroNT1 wrote:
Spoiler: show
Presumably this is just the author patching up the slight plothole of exactly where Treize got the Gundanium he used to make Epyon...on the other hand, it seems to open up ANOTHER plothole: how did OZ learn the procedure for making Gundanium that early? At least later in the series it could be justified with the existence of Mercurius and Vayeate, but if they had it all along it raises the question of why they never used it.

Spoiler: show
Well, they probably had the knowledge, but not the manufacturing capabilities. Aside from Epyon and the rebuilt Wing, all the Gundanium-armoured MS we see in the series are assembled in space. IIRC, it's been established that Gundanium has to be manufactured in microgravity - presumably the costs involved in setting up an extraterrestrial assembly facility, producing the Gundanium, and shipping the resulting to Earth were prohibitive, prior to Lady Une's sweet-talking of the Colonies? After all, the Alliance military needed enough MS to operate across the entire Earth Sphere, so the sheer amount of Gundanium they'd need for all those Leos probably put off the UESA beancounters :roll:


I'm pretty sure it's just the issue of cost and demand. Remember that they scaled back the Tallgeese to the Leo because of cost and having no need for such a powerful MS, and hadn't updated their MS for some 15-20 years because there was simply no need. There wasn't anyone left to oppose the Alliance once the colonies were suppressed. Why spend the extra money on a Gundanium Leo when a Toilet Paper Leo works just fine? At that point all they were doing were stomping out minor insurgents.

Though that brings up the question of why they were building a new Space Combat mobile suit before the Gundams showed up... there was no one for them to fight in space.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 12:19 pm 
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Don't forget, the Tallgeese wasn't shelved due to cost but because nobody could pilot the blasted thing without dying. Zechs was apparently the first pilot to "master" it.

As for the Taurus, technically speaking OZ/the Alliance didn't have any real opponents other than small bands of rebels who occasionally stole MS (and the Maganacs). The Taurus was just meant to be like the Aries or Pisces, a dedicated machine that would work better in its designated environment than the old Leo.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 2:31 pm 
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A key detail is that OZ were planning to take over and in their long term plan had their eyes sent on controlling space too. In that respect it makes sense they'd likely push for a more advance dedicated space MS. Endless Waltz adds to that by claiming the Serpent was an intended heavy duty replacement for the Leo which only got scrapped because favour fell to the Mobile Dolls project. Before in fighting crippled them, OZ seemed to have a keen idea that advancement was key to maintaining power and the show goes out of its way to point out the inflexible Alliance (and of course later Treize's realisation that his own traditions are empty and holding back progress).

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:14 pm 
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Just got through Chapters 14 and 15. We're around Episodes 7-8. Events really start diverging from those seen in the show now.

Spoiler: show
The Gundam pilots are converging on New Edwards Base as the Earth Sphere Alliance command staff are about to take their leave. Quatre starts conversing with Marshal Noventa during the lull in battle, with the other pilots arriving on scene to add their own two cents to the discussion. In the middle of it all, Treize calls out to the confused Gundam pilots, egging them on. A challenge Wufei gladly obliges to.

All while this is happening, Operation Pleiades, otherwise known as "Daybreak" in the TV Show, is progressing, with Zechs assault to wrest the Sanc Kingdom from Alliance's hands getting underway as well.

As the dialogues between the Gundam pilots and the Alliance command staff start to draw to a close, Heero arrives on scene late, with the original intent of their mission in mind. Trowa catches wind of Heero, assuming him to be an agent of the Barton Foundation, and fires upon him. Heero quickly retaliates with his buster rifle, with Trowa evading just in time. Quatre implores the shuttle that the Alliance command staff is on to take off immediately as he works to assist in fending off Heero, taking a hit from the buster rifle, destroying the Sandrock's Armadillo Armor.

While Quatre is recovering from the shock of the blow, shedding the scrapped pieces of armor from Sandrock's frame, Heero races off towards the escaping shuttle, cue Noventa's "Now young man, don't be foolish...!", and bares down on it with a beam saber.

Wu Fei lands on Treize's personal yacht, only to be challenged by Lady Une in a Leo. Duo informs Heero of his screw up, much to Heero's dismay, and the Gundams move to secure an escape route.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:19 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:05 pm 
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Am I the only person who thinks the add-ons from this manga are ludicrous and nonsensical? I really don't get why some people gush over them and hope that they'll be included with the Master Grades. I mean, slapping a couple of Maganac shields on top of Sandrock Kai EW's option armor isn't exactly a masterstroke of engineering.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:25 pm 
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Well, I'm rather passive toward them, except the most mundane Shenlong's Liaoya, which I actually like. Not because it carries a large Liuyedao (remove that, and I still like it), but because attach wire to its shield make throwing it sound more like practical attack (range maybe reduced, but retrieve it is much easier, and who know if it can be use like discus?).

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 Post subject: Re: Glory of Losers
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 5:33 pm 
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I like them. The only one I think was kinda dumb was Deathscythe's. Otherwise, everyone else's seems well in their elements. Sandrock was slated to be the most heavily armored Gundam, so its Armadillo Armor is a welcome addition. And Heavyarms Igel is just beautiful. I'm passive about Shenlong's Liaoya, and Wing hasn't gotten anything other than additional Buster Rifle magazines, which are pretty all it really needs.

Heavyarms's Osprey flight option does make sense from a plot-wise and suit capability standpoint, when considering that we're nearing the chaos of Episode 10. Remember that Heavyarms took the air attack route, so the Osprey option will allow it to achieve the sustained flight needed to secure the air corridor.

Chances are it'll get shot down, anyway, so...


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