Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:24 pm

2NA Fish wrote:Although my biggest gripe with ZZ is that ZZ Rommel was nowhere near as badass as the real Desert Fox. If they were gonna rip off a historical figure, they should have researched a bit more.
Oo I just watched that episode a few minutes ago. Where is this guy mentioned in one year war history? He was an interesting character and I would not mind finding out more about him.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Phoenix012 » Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:28 pm

As bad as the writing was at times, the main protagonists were actually likeable, and that's what makes the show worth watching. Like Zeta, the show was at its best once it got away from events centered solely around the Argama and showed how it fit within the broader events going on in the Earth Sphere.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:29 pm

Destiny_Gundam wrote:It's my favourite UC TV show. The comedy was funny and was a very welcome change from the bland bleakness of Zeta. Even when it did get more serious it still had that sense of fun to it and it didn't wear me out like Zeta and Victory did.
You might have also liked it with all of the pedo in it. :lol: especially with ple. But that aside I agree that this is a great show.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by TheGundamMKII » Sat Oct 08, 2011 5:30 pm

Double Zeta was certainly much more enjoyable than I had been lead to believe it would be.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Black Knight » Sat Oct 08, 2011 7:10 pm

NastyNate wrote:
2NA Fish wrote:Although my biggest gripe with ZZ is that ZZ Rommel was nowhere near as badass as the real Desert Fox. If they were gonna rip off a historical figure, they should have researched a bit more.
Oo I just watched that episode a few minutes ago. Where is this guy mentioned in one year war history? He was an interesting character and I would not mind finding out more about him.
Rommel exists only in ZZ. He was created for the series, so there's not really much more to "find out" about him than what's in the show.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:31 pm

Because some later characters end being more fleshed out later on, like Glemy started out as just a replacement for Char (because of CCA being approved and all), but them we started getting a bit more info and original background made for him and even cameos like in the Johnny Ridden manga.

But I don't really think Rommel is THAT interesting. He was really more like a "villain of the week" type person who just so happened to share a name with the WWII general, much like how a bunch of Zeon-related Gundam stuff tended to be.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:32 am

Gosh the Leina's Blood two parter is so intense. This is a polar opposite of what the show starts out as. You really see how human Judoe and ple are in this one too. I remember the first time I saw it I was almost to tears. And even still when I know the outcome that happens latter it is still really heart wrenching. Now that is good writing.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by TheGundamMKII » Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:12 pm

The Dakar episodes with Leina made her my favorite Gundam girl ever. I absolutely adore her.

She's on my future cosplay list, even though I'm not sure anyone would recognize me. LOL

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by JEFFPIATT » Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:56 pm

HalfDemonInuyasha wrote:Yeah, I do recall reading somewhere that at least the Gaza series was given stronger beam weaponry not only to counter its "simplistic weakness" (at least with the Gaza-C), but also because of the pilots NOT being all that great in the first place, so things like the Gaza swarming (like when Axis first revealed itself in Zeta by having Gaza-C's beam spam the Titan MS) are ways to make up for it.
That seems to be an pretty good depiction of axis. Harman's plan was to play the civil war for all of it's worth she basically had the Earth Federation forces destroy themselves and swooped in with her "superior" forces while the federation was too busy recovering and had a run of the earth sphere until she lost control and the EFSF forces swoop in and take credit for the gundam team's work. also around this time the earth fedration reverts there model codes back to the year based codes from the three digit model codes.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Mon Oct 10, 2011 11:57 pm

How could the federation go from this Highly efficient organized system back in the one year war and now in zeta it is totally unorganized and almost in a post apacoliptic system where there is no head and no since of who is in charge? Why are the federation helping the aeug. Weren't they the enemy of the titan's, which where the federation?

Also episode 34 "kamile's voice". Kamile is such an epic legend in that episode! I also really like puru. I hate that she has to die. And why can't Judou go with elle I really like her too.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Tue Oct 11, 2011 12:11 am

NastyNate wrote:How could the federation go from this Highly efficient organized system back in the one year war and now in zeta it is totally unorganized and almost in a post apacoliptic system where there is no head and no since of who is in charge? Why are the federation helping the aeug. Weren't they the enemy of the titan's, which where the federation?
As said, the Titans were merely a group formed by the Federation, but kept getting more and more power in order to do what they were supposedly formed to do (hunt down and dispose of Zeon remnants), but Jamitov played politician with the Federation and wrestled away so much power and authority to the point where they ran the Federation. However, after Char's speech at Dakar and revealing just how the Titans truly were, the Federation immediately retracted their initial support and started giving it to the AEUG to stop them, but by then, the Titans had already accumulated so much power and authority that it didn't matter much to them.

Because of the AEUG's, Axis Zeon's, and Scirocco's actions, the Titans ended up crumbling from both the inside (Scirocco assassinating Jamitov and Reccoa killing Bask, thus eliminating 2 of the most important Titan higher-ups) and the outside (taking over the Colony Laser, Federation fully supporting the AEUG, etc).

As for why the Federation became so weak. Part of it is most likely arrogance, others corruption (like Jamitov and the Titans), others fear (Haman making them believe Neo Zeon's power was far greater than it was), and such.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Ceiling_Squid » Tue Oct 11, 2011 12:14 am

NastyNate wrote:How could the federation go from this Highly efficient organized system back in the one year war and now in zeta it is totally unorganized and almost in a post apacoliptic system where there is no head and no since of who is in charge? Why are the federation helping the aeug. Weren't they the enemy of the titan's, which where the federation?
Well, to begin with, it helps to keep in mind that the Federation had just gone through the most horrific war in human history. Nothing in the Universal Century tops the scope of the One Year War. Many sources state outright that half the human race was dead by the end of the first month.

And the Federation, thereafter, had to expend tremendous resources to stop Zeon. And when you start adding in retcons like 0083, which actually goes out of its way to explain just what led to the creation of the Titans, you'll note that two thirds of the Federation fleet at the Naval Review were utterly wiped out, and on top of that, ANOTHER colony got dropped on the Earth, this time on the mass granary in North America.

I'm surprised the Feddies are even holding together by the time Zeta Gundam comes around. I'd argue that the world after the OYW was something akin to "post apocalyptic", exactly as you called it.

Now, as for the question of the Titans, that's answered a bit obliquely when Char actually gives his speech at Dakar in Zeta Gundam. The idea here was that the average citizen of the Federation, and even the average govt. official, was completley unaware of the vast majority of the evils the Titans had been committing. In the chaotic years after the One Year War, with minovsky particles still inundating the Earth sphere, exchange of information is difficult. It's quite likely that people had never heard of what happened at Colony 30. Even Emma was shocked to see exactly what lengths the Titans would go to, and she was a member of the Titans herself!

Basically, the moment the excesses the Titans were enacting actually were revealed to the world by Char and the AEUG at Dakar, the Federation disavowed the Titans. They were revealed to be a rogue element that had gained far too much power and autonomy, and was abusing that power to commit atrocities.

The Federation helped the AEUG precisely because the AEUG was fighting this rogue element. That, and it helps that many members of the AEUG were former Federation soldiers. They rebelled against the government because they believed that was the best way they could actually serve the federation as a whole.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Tue Oct 11, 2011 12:27 am

And then you got Haman dropping a colony on Dublin and Char dropping asteroids onto Earth (5th Luna being the only one seen).

And most of this stuff is is less than 10 years in between.

0079-0080 being the OYW, 3 years later with the Delaz Conflict in 0083, 4 years later is Zeta/ZZ from 0087 to 0089 (given they take place one right after the other), then just 4 years after that is CCA in 0093, now we got the Sleeves and Unicorn Gundam in 0096 just 3 years after that.

Such short intervals between such wars/conflicts will really add up, even to something as large as the Federation, even without being full scale bloody wars like the OYW.

Then, while still rebuilding after CCA, along comes the Crossbone Vanguard in UC 0123, then the Zanscare Empire in UC 0153.

Then we got also got non-canon stuff like the Mafty incident in the UC 0100s, the Mars Zeon/Oldsmobile Army uprising in the UC 0110s, and the Jupiter Empire in the UC 0130s...
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Tue Oct 11, 2011 3:14 pm

The federation seemed more organized in the new unicorn episodes or is that just me. Why did the federation just not reform and start over after the zeta gundam story? It is just the union of earth countries and with all the danger from the colonys they should have been motivated to reorganize.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by JEFFPIATT » Tue Oct 11, 2011 4:16 pm

by the time ZZ starts is shortly after zetas final battle where the AEUG and Titans fleets get for the most part practically destroyed and only the flagship is in any condition to handle a fight. Axis spent the grypts conflict sitting back and watching she only intervenes when it suits her agenda by damaging the gate of zedon and allowing the AEUG to control the laser. the only ms she deploys are the gaza c and the Quebely. by that point the EFF goverment just wants to appease the axis forces and lick there wounds. in fact it seems that only bright keeps the fight going and while the gundam team take advantage of glemmy starting an civl war between the axis forces does the EFSF show up and take credit.

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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Tue Oct 11, 2011 8:47 pm

I just watched episode 36 and the colony drop arc is so intense. I had a little bit of 0080 war in the pocket syndrome where I felt if I hoped hard enough one of the characters would not die. But Ple still died. :cry: She and elle are two of my favorite female characters in gundam. I can't remember if ple 2 has any likeable qualitys before she dies but I am sure I will get all sad for her too. Even though now she is so evil. :evil: Man I hope they keep Marida (Ple 12) alive in unicorn.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Imperial » Tue Oct 11, 2011 8:58 pm

NastyNate wrote:The federation seemed more organized in the new unicorn episodes or is that just me. Why did the federation just not reform and start over after the zeta gundam story? It is just the union of earth countries and with all the danger from the colonys they should have been motivated to reorganize.
They were reorganizing. Most of ZZ was a game of placating Haman long enough to rebuild their fleet, which was looking pretty piss poor after the Gryps War bit such a huge chunk out of it.

Sure, we see some amazingly corrupt big wigs talking about the colony depopulating the planet, but that's not really the crux of the Federation strategy if they're going to the trouble of rebuilding that big ol' fleet for the showdown that Glemy's rebellion spared them. The Federation of Unicorn is comparatively more organized because they've had a few years of mostly war-free time to bone back up.

As for your hopes of Marida, you probably shouldn't hold your breath.
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Arbiter GUNDAM » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:35 am

NastyNate wrote:Man I hope they keep Marida (Ple 12) alive in unicorn.
Yeah, I'm gonna second the don't hold your breath. I'd be willing to bet that this poor abused girl is going to die horribly. C'mon, this is the Universal Century we're talking about. :cry:
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by NastyNate » Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:45 pm

Do we ever know exactly why glemy betraid haman and all of the other zeon soldiers he had?

Do we know what Sayla was doing from the one year war up until now? Captain bright said in episode 46 "you sure are busy aren't you?" Sayla responds "I would rather die then sit on the sidelines and not fight". :shock: Is'nt that what she has been doing for the past decade? I mean what is preventing her from join the federation and fighting once more?

While we are at it. Where is Amuro during all of this?

Also what in the world was juduo thinking when he went to Jupiter with roux? Elle was looking so fine in that last scene and is so much a better choice than roux. Elle obviously loved him why roux seemed to just tolerate him. Why would he leave his little sister behind anyways? She is too young to be by herself, and he was supposed to send her to school. What is there at jupiter for them to even want to go in the first place?
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Re: Double Zeta: What do you think about it?

Post by Black Knight » Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:07 pm

Sayla: she was in medical school, and now she's a doctor.

Amuro: Hayato mentions that he's in space, probably rebuilding the AEUG/EFSF forces in preparation for an attack against Axis.

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