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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:38 pm 
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Cardboard Leo Ace
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Thanks Mark! That was a whole lot to take in! Very helpful though!

So how many test teams have been officially stated? The only one I know of for the Feddies is the one from Lost War Chronicles. That's about it.

Got a question on pilot suits... Does the color have any significant meaning? Like rank or team, or is it based purely on personal preference? I've seen 8 different colors for EFF pilot suits, those being White, Orange, Blue, Black, Red, Blue-ish Purple, Blue-ish Grey, and a Tan-ish Grey. As for Zeon, well there's just too many to count.

Lastly, Mark, I have to ask you, how'd you learn Japanese? Also, can you speak it, as well as you read it? I would like to learn more than anything else, but being 24, I feel like maybe my chance to learn has passed me by. Anyways, is there any pointers you could give me?


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:01 pm 
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OYW Fan wrote:
Got a question on pilot suits... Does the color have any significant meaning? Like rank or team, or is it based purely on personal preference? I've seen 8 different colors for EFF pilot suits, those being White, Orange, Blue, Black, Red, Blue-ish Purple, Blue-ish Grey, and a Tan-ish Grey. As for Zeon, well there's just too many to count.


There doesn't seem to be any meaning to the colors. About the only thing that pops up is the basic Federation pilot suit of the OYW to 0083 era is yellow, as seen with pilots like Kai, Hayato, Bate, Adel, and Monsha, along with random pilots in various series as well (Such as grunt pilots in MSG and 0083). White pilot suits are issued seemingly at random (Amuro has one, but so does Shiro in 08th MS Team, and later Kou Uraki, and maybe Keith too) and the pilots who have them have very little in common to suggest some purpose for the color (Particularly thanks to Shiro, who has his long before he starts to pilot). Most of the others are basically custom ones that we only see worn by one or two pilots, so I'd guess those are just based on preference or what was available at the time.

Zeon is pretty much the same. Their main suit is the green pilot suit that is shown regularly in MSG, but there are a number of ace pilots and special people who have custom colored suits.

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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:24 pm 
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OYW Fan wrote:
Thanks Mark! That was a whole lot to take in! Very helpful though!

So how many test teams have been officially stated? The only one I know of for the Feddies is the one from Lost War Chronicles. That's about it.

There's also the Marmot Team from Mobile Suit Gundam The Blue Destiny, which seems to have a similar purpose. Other than those two, though... I can't think of any by name.

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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:10 am 
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Yeah, I didn't know if I should have listed them, only because I knew they were a guinea pig team, but I didn't know if that only applied to them because Yu was the BD1's test pilot.

I found what seems to be a slight inaccuracy pertaining to the RGC-80 on Mark's Gundam Unofficial: MSV Collection section.

Quote:
RGC-80 GM Cannon (North American Front)

The combat deployment of the RGC-80 consisted of 14 units assigned to the Tianem and Revil fleets, 6 to the North American front, and 19 to the African front. The remaining 9 units were reportedly used to defend Jaburo. Of all the RGC-80 teams, the greatest results were produced by the units on the North American front. Zeon's North American forces, which had recently lost their commander but were otherwise undamaged, suffered a devastating blow from mixed teams of RGM-79 and RGC-80 units. In the history of the war between Zeon and the Federation, these battles should merit special mention, but they are relatively unknown.


If we go by what it says there, then apparently RGC-80s were never used by the White Dingos in Australia. Could it be that this statement was before the introduction of the Side Story?

Also, I'm curious as to who pilots the blue RGM-79SC pictured here: http://dongame-modeler.blog.ocn.ne.jp/.shared/image.html?/photos/uncategorized/2009/07/30/rgm79sc.jpg. I'm not positive, but I believe it is mark with the number 12. Could it be one of the MSV aces? I know that Francis Backmeyer and Tenneth A. Jung both used the standard green and black units, so the only other person that it could be is Lon Kou.

Lastly, I wanted to know if it's safe to assume that the C-88 Medea's dimensions, i.e. length and width, would be the same or relatively close to those of the original Medea? If not, would anyone happen to know what they might be? MAHQ has every figure listed as unknown for the C-88, and I don't have even the slightest clue where to find that information. So if anyone knows, that'd be great.


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 6:44 am 
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OYW Fan wrote:
So how many test teams have been officially stated? The only one I know of for the Feddies is the one from Lost War Chronicles. That's about it.


The one from Lost War Chronicles isn't really a test team; as I noted, they're officially classified as "MS Special Forces".

On the whole, the Federation doesn't make a habit of labeling teams as test or experimental units, so this tends to be more of an unofficial designation. The 11th Independent Mechanized Composite Corps from Blue Destiny, for example, is nicknamed the "Guinea Pig team" because their main mission is collecting GM combat data that can be used to update the software of other teams. (The Japanese word for "guinea pig" is "morumotto", which is apparently a corruption of the word "marmot" that comes via the Dutch. For this reason, a lot of Western fans are under the mistaken assumption that the team from Blue Destiny are called the "Marmot team.")

Another example comes from the 08th MS Team "U.C. 0079 + alpha" comic. Here, we're told that Sanders was originally assigned to a test corps based at Luna II that was known as the "Cobayo team" - which comes from the Spanish word for "guinea pig".


Quote:
Got a question on pilot suits... Does the color have any significant meaning? Like rank or team, or is it based purely on personal preference?


Can't see any pattern. Every now and then I start wondering if they relate to the service branch, but as far as I can tell it's pretty much random.


Quote:
Lastly, Mark, I have to ask you, how'd you learn Japanese? Also, can you speak it, as well as you read it? I would like to learn more than anything else, but being 24, I feel like maybe my chance to learn has passed me by. Anyways, is there any pointers you could give me?

I took some classes in college, but my conversation skills have atrophied horribly since then, so mostly I just read it nowadays. But 24 is super young, for heaven's sake! Go take a class! :-)


Quote:
I found what seems to be a slight inaccuracy pertaining to the RGC-80 on Mark's Gundam Unofficial: MSV Collection section.


It seems unfair to call it an "inaccuracy". The Rise From the Ashes game was released 15 years after the MSV books were written, so there was no way the authors could predict the future and know that game designers would be putting GM Cannons everywhere! Never mind how the Zaku Cannon now pops up all over the world in every game and comic.


Quote:
I'm not positive, but I believe it is mark with the number 12. Could it be one of the MSV aces? I know that Francis Backmeyer and Tenneth A. Jung both used the standard green and black units, so the only other person that it could be is Lon Kou.


I don't think it's ever been established. In any case, Jung and Lon Kou hadn't been invented when the MSV box art was painted, and they haven't used the magical power of retcon to match them up with any existing visuals.


Quote:
Lastly, I wanted to know if it's safe to assume that the C-88 Medea's dimensions, i.e. length and width, would be the same or relatively close to those of the original Medea?


Close, perhaps, but probably not the same. In any case, the specs we have for the original Medea come from the Roman Album books, whose figures tend to be a bit dodgy anyways. You're probably better off eyeballing it from the line art and/or anime stills. You might be amused by this thread as an example of estimating the dimensions of the Gaw attack carrier.

-- Mark


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:00 am 
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Cardboard Leo Ace
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Thanks again Mark, always a help.


Last edited by OYW Fan on Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:50 pm 
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toysdream wrote:
OYW Fan wrote:
So how many test teams have been officially stated? The only one I know of for the Feddies is the one from Lost War Chronicles. That's about it.


The one from Lost War Chronicles isn't really a test team; as I noted, they're officially classified as "MS Special Forces".

On the whole, the Federation doesn't make a habit of labeling teams as test or experimental units, so this tends to be more of an unofficial designation. The 11th Independent Mechanized Composite Corps from Blue Destiny, for example, is nicknamed the "Guinea Pig team" because their main mission is collecting GM combat data that can be used to update the software of other teams. (The Japanese word for "guinea pig" is "morumotto", which is apparently a corruption of the word "marmot" that comes via the Dutch. For this reason, a lot of Western fans are under the mistaken assumption that the team from Blue Destiny are called the "Marmot team.")

Another example comes from the 08th MS Team "U.C. 0079 + alpha" comic. Here, we're told that Sanders was originally assigned to a test corps based at Luna II that was known as the "Cobayo team" - which comes from the Spanish word for "guinea pig".


Interesting. A couple months ago, in the "Training Program" thread that popped up, I pointed out that Matt Healy's Delta Team and You Kajima's 11th Mechanized Composite Corps have similar profiles according to their respective manga.

Mixx Manga's Release of 'Mobile Suit Gundam The Blue Desinty' wrote:
The key to the Federation's strategy was the mass-produced Mobile Suit labeled RGM-79 GM. However, the Federation still lacked the ability to efficiently deploy the Mobile Suits. Such ability could only be gained through experience. Thus, a Mobile Suit team was designated for battle deployment. This special unit was permitted to act independently of the main troops.


Tokyopop's Release of 'Mobile Suit Gundam Lost War Chronicles' wrote:
The Earth Federation's technological resources were superior, but they were clearly lacking a strategic knowledge of war. As a result, the Earth Federation created a Mobile Suit unit for the purpose of collecting and analyzing data in combat conditions. This unit was subjected to dangerous, unpredictable conditions throughout the world. As a result, they were known as the Experimental Unit.

Looking at those again, though, it seems more like they're teams charged with data collection rather than specifically testing new Mobile Suits (which seems to just be a perk of the job). Is that what most of these unofficial "guinea pig teams" really are?

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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:09 pm 
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Nowhere Man wrote:
nteresting. A couple months ago, in the "Training Program" thread that popped up, I pointed out that Matt Healy's Delta Team and You Kajima's 11th Mechanized Composite Corps have similar profiles according to their respective manga.


D'oh! You're quite right. Both the Lost War Chronicles comic and the game itself make it pretty clear that this "Special Forces" label is basically a fig leaf, and the main function of these guys is to gather test data. From the game intro itself:

Quote:
In this stalemated situation, both the Federation and Zeon forces invested in special forces as a desperation measure. On the one hand, jack-of-all-trades units known as "test corps." On the other, expendable "foreign legions" made up of people without Zeon citizenship.


And from the game manual:

Quote:
The MS Special Forces could be described as a unit whose primary function was to gather combat data with mobile suits, which was abruptly deployed in major operations all over the world as a desperation measure on the part of the Federation. However, this was purely a cover story. The fact is that, as the Federation built up its forces for the coming space campaign, it was unable to devote enough fighting strength to its ground forces. This so-called "test corps" was a jack-of-all-trades unit deployed mainly in dangerous missions as a substitute.


So, just to review: They're nominally an elite special forces team, but that's just a cover for their real function of collecting MS combat data, which is just a cover for their real real function of making up for the Federation's lack of terrestrial fighting strength. Huh.

Quote:
Looking at those again, though, it seems more like they're teams charged with data collection rather than specifically testing new Mobile Suits (which seems to just be a perk of the job). Is that what most of these unofficial "guinea pig teams" really are?


Yep. Unlike Zeon, the Federation is placing its hopes on legions of mass-produced GMs rather than a handful of high-performance superweapons, so its main concern is to make sure that these GMs are operating at the peak of their capabilities.

-- Mark


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 3:10 am 
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I'm having trouble trying to find an exact roll-out date for the RX-78-4 and 5. Like the majority of Feddie MS, were they launched sometime in mid to late November? I'm also assuming that their development took place in Jaburo, though I could also see Luna II as a working launch pad too. If anyone could let me know, that'd be great.

My next question pertains to Master Pierce Rayer. I'm just wondering if Master is his actual name, or is it more like a title, with Pierce being his first name? Ok, those are the only things I got right now. Feedback is much appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 3:58 am 
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OYW Fan wrote:
I'm having trouble trying to find an exact roll-out date for the RX-78-4 and 5. Like the majority of Feddie MS, were they launched sometime in mid to late November? I'm also assuming that their development took place in Jaburo, though I could also see Luna II as a working launch pad too. If anyone could let me know, that'd be great.

According to the "Encounters in Space" side story, they were rolled out in time to be launched into space along with the rest of the Federation fleet, so this would probably be in November or December depending on when you think the launch took place. :-)

As for the development site, the MG kit manual says that they were created at Jaburo, but a bunch of development and testing staff from Augusta came to perform the final modifications. I guess that's supposed to explain why Katoki's version has all those Alex parts.

Quote:
My next question pertains to Master Pierce Rayer. I'm just wondering if Master is his actual name, or is it more like a title, with Pierce being his first name? Ok, those are the only things I got right now. Feedback is much appreciated.

Nope, "Master" is his first name. Hence "Master P. Rayer" -> "Master Player."

-- Mark


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:45 am 
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toysdream wrote:
According to the "Encounters in Space" side story, they were rolled out in time to be launched into space along with the rest of the Federation fleet, so this would probably be in November or December depending on when you think the launch took place. :-)

Speaking of the Lost War Chronicles manga, Luce Kassel and Ford Romfellow actually make a cameo right before the Zeon assault on Jaburo. They're complaining to Lt. Woody about... something. I can't remember exactly what and I don't have the manga in front of me to check. I think it might have something to do with the Thoroughbred. However, both are in their normal suits (IIRC) -- the ones with the G04 and G05 designations on them (also IIRC). So it would seem that the G04 and G05 were assigned to the Thoroughbred and given pilots by November 30th. If they had actually been rolled out by then, I couldn't guess. But if they were still far from completion at this point, I don't see why the above would be the case.

Come to think of it, the RX-78-6 Gundam Mudrock was also nearing completion around this time (as it came to the defense of the Blanc Rival while still incomplete). Perhaps the development of G04 and G05 was also connected to the Mudrock's development in some fashion?

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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:14 pm 
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So I know this thread hasn't been used in awhile, but any time I have a question it usually always concerns the OYW. Anyways, I've been wondering about the status of the UK, more specifically the British Isles, during the OYW. Did the Zeons ever manage to occupy them, and were the isles, like Ireland, used as the staging ground for launching of Operation Odessa?


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:19 pm 
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So I take it no one really has any specific or definitive information regarding the status of the British Isles during the OYW. The only information I could find that mentions Britain during the OYW was from Mark Simmon's Gundam, which states...

U.C. 0079.10.10
18:00 The Federation's 3rd Army, commanded by General Revil, departs from the Southampton base in Britain.
* Source: Entertainment Bible 39.

U.C. 0079.10.11
02:50 General Revil's forces cross the Strait of Dover. The Federation Forces begin their advance toward Odessa.
* Source: Entertainment Bible 39.

These lead me to believe that the British Isles were able to hold off Zeon occupation attempts, but this is just speculation. Any solid feedback would be much appreciated.

Also, was Gibraltar ever mentioned in any Gundam texts? Did it play any sort of role in the war?

Final question for this post, deals with the RGM-79[G] and if it had different color schemes for the regions it was deployed. In some pictures from the Odessa campaign, the color scheme appears to be white and red, where as for the South East Asia front, they appear to be the tan and orange that we all know of. Is this correct or am I mistaken? Any information on these would be awesome. Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:04 pm 
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OYW Fan wrote:
These lead me to believe that the British Isles were able to hold off Zeon occupation attempts, but this is just speculation. Any solid feedback would be much appreciated.

Also, was Gibraltar ever mentioned in any Gundam texts? Did it play any sort of role in the war?


The maps from the different MS Igloo OVAs might provide some answers to your questions:

Map of Europe before Operation Odessa.

So, England escapes the invasion and Gibraltar doesn't.

However in Zeon's original projection, they intended to occupy it by August:

Map of Zeon advance between April and May.

Map of Zeon's projected advance by August.

Finally, some maps showing a closer look to the european territories that Zeon invaded before Operation Odessa:

Operation Map 1

Operation Map 2


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:37 pm 
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Wow! Thank you so much, those were extremely helpful! So it appears that Jaburo and the British Isles/Ireland were the last strong holds of the Federation during the OYW, and from these two areas, they were able to strike back at Zeon. Now the two maps that show the entire globe, they're just Zeon projections correct? Do you know of any maps that show the actual extent of Zeon front lines?

Also, with this map - http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/YFX-600R_GuAIZ_EFT/ZeonInvasionEuropePreOdessa.jpg, what does the orange represent?


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:01 pm 
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The first global map shows the actual advance of Zeon somewhere between April 29th (when the 128th supply depot is destroyed) and May 9th (destruction of the 67th supply depot). The other global map shows the territory they expect to control by August. Basically the first is real and the second is just a projection which is ultimately not met.

Regarding maps that show the whole conquered territory, you can see a glimpse in the maps from episode 1 of MS Igloo 2, but the problem is that the map begins to slowly expand showing the Zeon advance, but before its finished, the map is already starting to burn from the center. Unless someone makes a composite image, you can't see the whole map. there should be other maps showing the invaded territory, but I can't particuarly remember one at the time.

Finally, I suppose that the orange parts are territory currently being disputed (which isn't completely under the control of Zeon or the Federation).


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:18 pm 
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The idea of the orange being disputed areas, could be the case. However, I think it might make more sense that this is territory taken back by the Federation on their march towards Warsaw, before the actual assault on Odessa begins. I say this because it shows a clear path towards Warsaw, Poland which we know is the location from which a field HQ is assembled for Operation Odessa. Just an opinion though. I came up with it, because thanks to MS Era, we know that Paris was occupied quite early on, so I can't see it being disputed at that moment in time.

You wouldn't happen to have any ideas about the discrepancies in the color schemes shown for the RGM-79[G] units would you? Or are my eyes just playing tricks on me?


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 10:31 pm 
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OYW Fan wrote:
The idea of the orange being disputed areas, could be the case. However, I think it might make more sense that this is territory taken back by the Federation on their march towards Warsaw, before the actual assault on Odessa begins. I say this because it shows a clear path towards Warsaw, Poland which we know is the location from which a field HQ is assembled for Operation Odessa. Just an opinion though. I came up with it, because thanks to MS Era, we know that Paris was occupied quite early on, so I can't see it being disputed at that moment in time.

You wouldn't happen to have any ideas about the discrepancies in the color schemes shown for the RGM-79[G] units would you? Or are my eyes just playing tricks on me?


If you check the first two episodes of Ms Igloo 2, you will see that in those maps the orange line is also present when Zeon is advancing and those areas are being repainted with red while the adjacent areas also become orange.

Regarding the red and white RGM-79[G], the only place I have seen the two color schemes at once is on the PS3 game Gundam Crossfire, which used color schemes to show untis customzied for jungle, desert and marine combat, but also for normal and heavy type MS, where the red and white scheme is for a "normal" RGM-79[G], while the traditional colors are for the "heavy" RGM-79[G]. The RX-79[G] is also shown in its traditional color scheme as the "heavy" RX-79[G].


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 5:40 pm 
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I have that game, but I've never noticed that. I'll have to check on that!

New questions...

Has there ever been any mention of who may have been the very first test pilot for Federation MS? If I recall correctly, I vaguely remember reading somewhere that the first person to pilot a Feddie MS was actually a Zeon POW, who was forced into helping the Federation test it's MS. I could be mistaken, as I can't remember any specifics, like his name and such. This leads me to wonder what model of MS he was forced to test pilot.

Second question...

Has it ever been explained, as to why they chose to equip the RX-79BD-1 With a GM head? Seeing as how it was built from an RX-79[G] you would assume they would just use what's already there. Was there an legitimate reason behind it, or just a design the writer/artist enjoyed?

This last question is probably a dumb one, but the RGM-79[G] was developed after the RX-79[G] correct?


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 Post subject: Re: Random OYW Questions
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:04 pm 
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OYW Fan wrote:
This last question is probably a dumb one, but the RGM-79[G] was developed after the RX-79[G] correct?


Nope. Mark notes in this post that a few sources suggest that the RGM-79[G] came first, but I also stumbled onto this older thread on the subject which goes into more detail and suggests both machines may have been developed at the same time. Either way, the RX-79[G] doesn't come first.

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