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 Post subject: Ep. 006: Blade Runner
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:46 am 
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Bald Wizard
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Chaos Theater Ep. 006 - "Blade Runner"
- Download Now: 64 kbps - 90 mins, 39 sec. (1:30:39) 41.6 MB

Segment Breakdown for this Episode:

01. Intro: "What We've Been Up To" and "Slaying the Sacred Cow"
Runtime: 0:00:01 - 0:20:22

02. Discussion: "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?" and "Blade Runner"
Runtime: 0:20:48 - 1:02:34

03. Outro: "Chaos Theater Mailbag" and "Internet whoring"
Runtime: 1:03:08 - 1:29:59

We're going double duty this episode with a discussion of Philip K. Dick's classic novel Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? as well as the film it inspired, Ridley Scott's 1982 classic Blade Runner. Another sacred cow is sent to the barbecue, and we close out with your questions in our Mailbag. Also, we're finally on iTunes, so you can subscribe to us there. Please rate us and give us reviews! Next time, MAHQ co-founder Dale Rausch joins us for an in-depth discussion of the 1990s Batman: The Animated Series.

Music Featured in this Episode:
"Boing Zoom DAKOTA!" from Rock Candy 1 by Shadow
"Science is Fun" from Portal 2: Songs to Test By by Aperture Science Psychoacoustics Laboratory

Sponsors & Special Offers:
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Email: chaostheatershow@gmail.com

Websites:
MAHQ.net - Gundamn.net - Chaos Theater -Laplace's Box -Chaos Theater Mecha Talk Forum - Gundamn! @ Mecha Talk Forum - Laplace's Box @ Mecha Talk Forum - MAHQ.net @ Twitter - Chaos Theater @ Twitter - Gundamn! @ Twitter - Laplace's Box @Twitter - Main RSS Feed

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"What did catch my eye, however, was a podcast named Gundamn!. At first I thought it was a podcast about firearms and [rednecks] discussing their collection, but after looking at the episode titles I was sold." - Xhavalor

PSN: amuromsz006
3DS: 1177-6671-6035


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 Post Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 10:52 pm 
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OMG Doomsday Laser
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My comments for this episodes.

Puritanism is one of those things I have noticed sometimes and it is rather annoying the way some people are and become rather selective, an example of one user here on mechatalk is "Gundamium Alloy"
So that is an example of someone not interested in shows or games with excessive violence or sexual references ect.

Blade Runner: I've got the director's cut of the movie sitting on my "to watch pile" for scifi movies.

It's caught my interest along with 1-2 other titles I never got around to seeing.
So I plan to watch it and your segment Blade Runner has perked my interest more and want to see it more so now.

I will say I got the movie a little while before though, like just before you started up Chaos Theater.

As for the question answers yeah at least Pedro knows what I meant, but those games can occupy so much of your time and all that, not sure if Chris would ever be interested to dive in to them and give them a try.
I personally liked Disgaea 2 more the most myself and played that one alot more.


As for the Retro cartoons list yeah I did use tv tropes glancing my shelves and using youtube to make up that list.

I know demographs kind of change, but then again also, I just think there is lack of creatively interesting shows or with decent concepts and stories, just my opinion on it.

Might add more to this post later, enjoyed this episode a bit.


Last edited by Mu La Flaga on Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:27 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 4:55 am 
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Pilot's Doomed Girlfriend
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I agree that Blade Runner is a film that has aged really well. Esp with the bluray remaster, when I watched my copy, I was stunned how good it still looked and retained a 'big budget' feel with visual FX that matched modern standards. The Spinner STILL looks futuristic, I don't know why it doesn't look cheesy or out of date.

The only other 80s movie I feel has aged nearly as well is Ghostbusters 1. Ironically Ghostbusters 2 got dated really fast.


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 Post Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 7:53 am 
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Mecha Flunky
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I feel the need to jump into the discussion regarding fanservice in regard to anime (and I'd like to point out that this "puritanism is not just an American problem, then again most people in America tend to ignore the fact that Europe even exists).

Now, being a guy myself, obviously I can see the appeal of fanservice of the erotic variety and enjoy it myself. What I would argue however with this whole "fanservice ruins the show" thing is that nowadays, fanservice itself has reached a point of oversaturation. Fanservice (the boobs and ass variety. Today barely anyone even uses the the term for anything that's not related to anything sexual, which is kinda depressing) is present in nearly every show that's coming out these days from Japan. The issue that I see with it is that it's too much "right in your face", sometimes to a point where it really does start to irritate you and it takes the focus off the other parts of the story.

A lot of people would probably argue that in the past, fanservice of the erotic variety was more tasteful and somewhat more teaserish that it is today, that your mind would be more attracted to what you don't see than what you see. A very nice-looking dress that characters usually don't wear is already a more tasteful way of fanservice than what you find most of these days (an example would be Faye's opera dress in that Cowboy Bebop episode where she meets Vicious). I facepalm nearly everytime some questionable element in an episode causes a girl to loose all of her clothes, is splattered with some milky looking liquid or what else. It's just too blunt in my opinion and I wonder why there's such a massive increase in fanservice on television anime, but apparently a decrease in the production of Hentai, were some of that stuff would probably be more fitting.

Fanservice is all fine and good and I enjoy my scantly-clad, big-boobed anime characters, but the more fanservice becomes "mainstream", the less appealing I find it. I used to argue that fanservice was a "treat" to the fans and not just "here's your boobs, kids", but as the industry is today, living the "sex sells" mentality, it sort of begins to become uninteresting and stale. Some people would even argue that it's getting more and more immature.

Furthermore, a lot of people accuse anime these days of being less inventive as they were a decade or two ago because of fanservice being more and more the norm and being a bigger selling point than a story, especially when you have a show on TV that is ridiculously censored and just works as a means to get you to buy the DVD/BD which is less censored or completely uncensored. Sure, there's still shows who don't capitalize on that variety of fanservice as much as that, but they are getting overwhelmed by other shows which do, simply because it promises better sales.


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 Post Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 9:40 pm 
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Creepy Bishonen
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Haven't heard the whole episode yet (still debating on whether or not to watch Blade Runner again before I do, it's been about 10 years), but I had to listen to the sacred cow slaughter first. I think Chris has it down pretty good, it's puritanism, and if you're over 20, don't freak out when you see cartoon breasts. Honestly I think the majority of the people who have these complaints aren't adults, and there's nothing wrong with that (we have to share the internet with people of all ages, ethnicities, etc.). There's nothing you can do about those people, and if you see them making those comments, just ignore them. I agree it can get annoying though, every time a new Tekken game comes out it's like, "Wahhh, why did they make my favorite character a WHORE, god, her breasts are too big, they ruined her, blah blah blah" shut up and play the damn game or don't, hahaha.

As for Pedro's comments: I wouldn't consider Mirai's breasts 'fan-service'; she didn't even have nipples, hahaha! You reminded me that I've gotta watch Gankutsuou again though, there were some awfully pretty pretty-boys in that one.


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 Post Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:57 pm 
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Bald Wizard
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Saber wrote:
Furthermore, a lot of people accuse anime these days of being less inventive as they were a decade or two ago because of fanservice being more and more the norm and being a bigger selling point than a story, especially when you have a show on TV that is ridiculously censored and just works as a means to get you to buy the DVD/BD which is less censored or completely uncensored. Sure, there's still shows who don't capitalize on that variety of fanservice as much as that, but they are getting overwhelmed by other shows which do, simply because it promises better sales.


I think this is an issue of nostalgia clouding reality. There has always been trashy, bad anime in every decade. There's always going to be a group of fans of anything who will say that things were better in the past than they are now. That's just a given.

On your broader points, I don't see fanservice as some plague infecting anime. Even for all the stuff that gets fansubbed now, think about all the stuff that doesn't get fansubbed that Western fans completely ignore. We're only looking at a slice and assuming that the trends apply to the entire pie.

Also, when it comes to fanservice it really depends on what you're watching. If you're watching Queen's Blade, Samurai Girls or Highschool of the Dead, expect lots of bouncing boobs. I saw people complaining endlessly about the boobs in Highschool, at which point I wonder why they're even watching it. Don't attack a show for having fanservice when that's clearly one of its selling points. My issue has always been with people who have an absolutist attitude that any fanservice whatsoever is always to the detriment of story or character development.

_________________
"What did catch my eye, however, was a podcast named Gundamn!. At first I thought it was a podcast about firearms and [rednecks] discussing their collection, but after looking at the episode titles I was sold." - Xhavalor

PSN: amuromsz006
3DS: 1177-6671-6035


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 Post Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:14 pm 
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Mecha Flunky
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Chris wrote:
I think this is an issue of nostalgia clouding reality. There has always been trashy, bad anime in every decade. There's always going to be a group of fans of anything who will say that things were better in the past than they are now. That's just a given.


That is true, without a doubt.

Quote:
On your broader points, I don't see fanservice as some plague infecting anime. Even for all the stuff that gets fansubbed now, think about all the stuff that doesn't get fansubbed that Western fans completely ignore. We're only looking at a slice and assuming that the trends apply to the entire pie.


There's always exceptions, that's a given. But would you really disagree that the level of more aggressive fanservice has increased in these last 10 or so years? Or do I just happen to watch "the wrong shows"?

Then again, it heavily depends on what kind of fanservice we're even arguing about. I mean, I for one have no problem that a lot of shows have a hot spring or beach episode, but these days even a lot of normal shows have a pretty high level of fanservice that's really aggressive in the way it's executed, as in the producers not even trying to at least package it well and all.

I'm a guy in my 20s. I love boobs. But just because I like me a good pair or two of them, that doesn't mean that every series I happen to watch has to shove them into my face like a running joke.

Quote:
I saw people complaining endlessly about the boobs in Highschool, at which point I wonder why they're even watching it. Don't attack a show for having fanservice when that's clearly one of its selling points.


I'd guess people complain about the fanserviceness of HOTD because it is a show/manga which has a lot of potential, interesting characters and a setting not found very often in anime. Other than HOTD, I couldn't think of any other anime off the top of my head that featured a zombie apocalypse. Perhaps people would like to see that concept be taken a bit more... seriously, if that makes any sense?

In that case, I'm guessing that people bitch about HOTD because it has a very interesting premise but the fanservice-orientation is kind of holding it down, or hinder it from being a good, mature work? I know at least for my case that I watched (and am currently reading) Highschool of the Dead because of the premise and the characters, the fanservice was completely irrelevant to me to tell the truth. I mean, I for one really like Saeko as a character, but all that stuff with her wearing nothing but an apron for like 3 episodes and even fighting in that, that was a bit too much for me. It is a ridiculous show at times, no question, but there's a point for everyone where it's just too much. In this example, it's not a matter of prudery, but a matter of sense.

By no means am I attacking HOTD or anything, I like that show actually, but truth be told, do you not see that this series could go on with its story and characters without all the fanservice and that's the reason why people could bitch about it?

Quote:
My issue has always been with people who have an absolutist attitude that any fanservice whatsoever is always to the detriment of story or character development


As I said, I have no issue with fanservice, that is, as long as the dosis is appropriate and is in good balance to the rest of the show, that is at least if the show has a story that is actually necessary. I mean, even I'm not dumb enough to defend a show like Queen's Blade for having an intriguing narrative or anything, but there's stuff out there that does.

HOTD does have a story, not like QB which is just there to get the setup going and vaguely explain why there's all these busty chicks in wierd costumes and shallow armor fighting it out and getting their clothes torn apart. HOTD has the fanservice, but it has the other stuff, too, in good proportions.


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 Post Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:58 pm 
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Bald Wizard
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On the issue of HotD, yes, the story could easily be done without fanservice, but it wasn't created that way. The manga is brimming with fanservice, and that's the way the creator wanted it. You just look at the character designs from the manga or anime where every female except Alice has an enormous rack, and you have to know what you're getting yourself into. To watch the show knowing that it's going to be heavy in fanservice and yet still bitch about the fanservice is foolish. Of course, I'm not talking about you, Saber, but rather the people who complain about HotD. If you want a serious zombie apocalypse without fanservice, go read World War Z or watch an early Romero movie, but don't expect HotD to fit that bill 100%.

Yes, I will admit that there is more fanservice lately in shows the past few years, but I don't think there's a causal effect between the amount of fanservice a show has and how good or bad it is. There's also varying degrees of fanservice between shows. Gundam 00 had a lot of busty characters, but the most extreme the fanservice went was some bikinis and a Sumeragi shower scene where she didn't have nipples. And then during S2 all those busty characters are in those anti-fanservice Celestial Being uniforms, and there's not a bikini in sight.

_________________
"What did catch my eye, however, was a podcast named Gundamn!. At first I thought it was a podcast about firearms and [rednecks] discussing their collection, but after looking at the episode titles I was sold." - Xhavalor

PSN: amuromsz006
3DS: 1177-6671-6035


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 Post Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:43 am 
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I'm seeing a pattern, it seems no women on the bridge have nipples!

I think any lack of fanservice in S2 was made up for by Tieria's weird woman-costume dance with Ribbons.

edit: Listened to the whole show, I've gotta watch Blade Runner again, but now I'm really interested in that book. Sounds like a lot of great ideas were tossed around in there, and that robot-manned police station part sounds intense!


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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:04 pm 
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Mecha Flunky
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Thanks for reviewing my all time favorite movie. I bought the Blu-ray 5 disc complete collection when it came out, even though I do not own a blu-ray player. I was all up in arms when at the 40 minute mark you mentioned that Bladerunner was a "most influential movie visually" but failed to mention Syd Mead. Fortunately you did get to him at the 54 minute mark when discussing the visual designs of the film. It's amazing how much it has withstood the test of time. Thanks again.


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