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 Post Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:51 pm 
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I thoroughly enjoined the ride on the Destiny hate train. :D

I do have to say that the misogyny was flying a little thick in there, although it was understandable with totally lame and inconsistent characterizations of Talia (I'm with you SoulBro), Lunamaria (brings shame to the red Zaku), Cagalli (WTH, her lame factor was 11), and Lacus (boring). The only interesting female character was Mia, the Lacus look alike. I could believe that she was a real person.

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 Post Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 5:52 pm 
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You know every anime takes something from other anime right and yet Gundam seed destiny get hate because of the Goufs, Zakus etc. The Zeon Zaku I am sorry to anybody here sucked. The Zaft Zaku is better why it actucally stands a chance against a Gundam expect for the Infinte Justice, and Skrike Freedom which are the high-tech models well both sides Cylne Faction and Zaft got alittle high-tech toward the end their. I like they had beam shields and beam deflection systeams Which I thought was petty cool.

Btw did any body notice that in last ep of Gundam 00 S2 that one the Gundams looks like the RX-78 from Moblie Gundam 0079? As far takes off from the older Gundam series are concered I like the fact we get to see the Zakus, Goufs,etc look like in CGI. There is alot tributes to the old days of Gundam back in late 70's and 80's and early 90's.


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 Post Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:51 pm 
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Athrun 77 wrote:
You know every anime takes something from other anime right and yet Gundam seed destiny get hate because of the Goufs, Zakus etc. The Zeon Zaku I am sorry to anybody here sucked. The Zaft Zaku is better why it actucally stands a chance against a Gundam expect for the Infinte Justice, and Skrike Freedom which are the high-tech models well both sides Cylne Faction and Zaft got alittle high-tech toward the end their. I like they had beam shields and beam deflection systeams Which I thought was petty cool.

Btw did any body notice that in last ep of Gundam 00 S2 that one the Gundams looks like the RX-78 from Moblie Gundam 0079? As far takes off from the older Gundam series are concered I like the fact we get to see the Zakus, Goufs,etc look like in CGI. There is alot tributes to the old days of Gundam back in late 70's and 80's and early 90's.



Yeah, that Gundam was in the show before, they just gave it a new paint job and a large GN Condenser. And then said condenser was removed... It's called 0 Gundam.

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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 1:06 am 
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Great job it was a fun listen. I wanted to mention one good thing I liked about destiny was the mech design for blast impulse. It looked much cooler than the other impulse colors and the green worked and the beam trident thing was cool.

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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 7:30 am 
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Chris wrote:
No, it was an actual design - a top-heavy giant backpacked Gundam. The lineart was featured in Anime Insider about 5 years ago. What I said was the concept of combined packs was carried on to the Destiny, but there is an actual design of the early Freedom.


I believe that this is that Freedom concept drawing in question, with its "Surprise, You're Dead!" backpack burst mode. If I remember right, one of the big hobby magazines also put together their own model variation based on this too.


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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:12 am 
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Muser wrote:
I believe that this is that Freedom concept drawing in question, with its "Surprise, You're Dead!" backpack burst mode. If I remember right, one of the big hobby magazines also put together their own model variation based on this too.


Yes, that is the one, although someone has obviously colored it in, since in the magazine it was black and white before.

Athrun 77 wrote:
You know every anime takes something from other anime right and yet Gundam seed destiny get hate because of the Goufs, Zakus etc. The Zeon Zaku I am sorry to anybody here sucked. The Zaft Zaku is better why it actucally stands a chance against a Gundam expect for the Infinte Justice, and Skrike Freedom which are the high-tech models well both sides Cylne Faction and Zaft got alittle high-tech toward the end their.


No one is doubting the technical ability of those suits in DESTINY. What we said was it doesn't fit the SEED universe because these Zaku, Gouf and Dom designs look like a step backwards from what ZAFT already had with the GINN and GuAIZ. It just looks bad because you have these suits thrown in that stick out as looking less advanced than their predecessors.

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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:59 am 
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Chris wrote:
Muser wrote:
I believe that this is that Freedom concept drawing in question, with its "Surprise, You're Dead!" backpack burst mode. If I remember right, one of the big hobby magazines also put together their own model variation based on this too.


Yes, that is the one, although someone has obviously colored it in, since in the magazine it was black and white before.


Am I the only one who likes that more than the real Freedom?

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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:44 am 
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snoops619 wrote:
Am I the only one who likes that more than the real Freedom?

I might too if not for the ridiculously HUGE hip guns seriously what are those things?

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 Post Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:45 am 
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I remember when I first read about GSD in Anime Insider few years back. I got the impression that I was going to enjoy it. To make al ong story short I hated it and could no longer stand the sight of the Freedom or Strike Freedom or Kira. But I did like the Murasame, it was like the love child of the Zeta and Astray, I also liked the Destiny Gundam even if it did get the short end of the stick. Anyway I'm sure there will never be a Gundam series I hate more than Destiny which reminds me of something funny I read on Youtube saying that not only was Gundam SEED Destiny the best Gundam ever made but it was also the best anime ever made.

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 Post Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:17 pm 
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The designs of the Zeon MS-clones definitely look comparatively outdated, but I wouldn't say they looked less powerful than something like the GINN (although the GuAIZ is another matter). Of course, even in UC many mobile suits from 0080, 0083 and 08th MS Team look a lot more sophisticated than machines from the OYW era or the Gryps conflict. I think it's largely due to the fact that over the years, mecha designs have progressed towards being slimmer and having more details. Just judging by looks, it'd be hard to guess the GM Sniper II was over a decade older than the Jegan. Of course when it came to UC, the designers probably had to maintain an equilibrium between being modern and true to the universe at the same time. I'd definitely agree that, with the freedom of being an AU, the SEED designs really should have stuck with the theme of things.

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:57 am 
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A lot people have dubbed Destiny especially with characters like Kira, Athrun, Mu, etc. as well as their MS to be too overpowered as well most of the fight being completed one sided especially when they're on screen (except for Operation Angel Down) to the point where people cried "HAX!" or "Cheap Plot Armor/Shield!" mainly stuff saying that Kira and his friends are way too overpowered.

Ever since the introduction of the 00 Raiser, a lot of Gundam fans have deemed the 00 Raiser pretty much especially after the Trans-Am Burst was revealed to have surpassed Gundam Seed Destiny in terms of plot gimicks and hax. Basically, the Strike Freedom Gundam and Kira Yamato have been dethroned by the 00 Raiser and Setsuna who can beat anyone by using Trans-Am. It was pretty much to the point where a superior machine paranormal abilities was making up for poor piloting skills. Do you think its fair to a categorize the 00 Raiser in the same category as the Strike Freedom? I mean there are several individuals that said Gundam 00 is mediocre or that it completely sucks worse than GSD.


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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:05 am 
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MindlessFire wrote:
Ever since the introduction of the 00 Raiser, a lot of Gundam fans have deemed the 00 Raiser pretty much especially after the Trans-Am Burst was revealed to have surpassed Gundam Seed Destiny in terms of plot gimicks and hax. Basically, the Strike Freedom Gundam and Kira Yamato have been dethroned by the 00 Raiser and Setsuna who can beat anyone by using Trans-Am. It was pretty much to the point where a superior machine paranormal abilities was making up for poor piloting skills. Do you think its fair to a categorize the 00 Raiser in the same category as the Strike Freedom?


No, I don't think it's a proper comparison, even though many people who want to complain about 00 use this as a point of contention. The whole point of the 00 Raiser is that the Twin Drive System gives it abilities bordering on the paranormal, as directly stated in the show. In the case of Kira and the Strike Freedom, there's no technology inside that suit that makes it particularly special when compared to the Infinite Justice, Destiny or Legend, but its still invincible regardless and takes absolutely zero damage. I think the fact that the Strike Freedom didn't get a single scratch at the end of DESTINY but the 00 Raiser was almost completely destroyed in 00 puts to rest any complaints of it being overpowered.

As far as piloting skills go, the development of Kira and Setsuna has been the opposite. Kira showed some actual skill in the Strike, but once he moved on to the Freedom and Strike Freedom, it was clear he was relying more on the machines than his own skills. Setsuna has improved in many ways, even after upgrading to a more powerful suit. If you look back to the early episodes of 00, it's clear that shooting wasn't one of his strengths.

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:14 am 
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[quote="Chris"]In the case of Kira and the Strike Freedom, there's no technology inside that suit that makes it particularly special when compared to the Infinite Justice, Destiny or Legend, but its still invincible regardless and takes absolutely zero damage.[/quote]

Yes I would completely agree. But for some odd reasons the model kits kept retconning things about Strike Freedom like the “Voiture Lumière” system found similarly in the Destiny therefore allowing it generate afterimages just like the F91 was now also on the Strike Freedom. And then they add the fact the SF's golden joints are used to endure ultra-mobility beyond the limits of its design. The manual of the Master Grade 1/100 model kit says that activating HiMAT Full Burst mode and the Super DRAGOONs at the same time was virtually impossible unless the pilot was some sort of a super coordinator. When using its Voiture Lumiere to travel at high speeds, it's the Phase Shift Armor that's actually holds the mobile suit together.

In a way the whole retconning of the model kits felt like the creators was competing the Strike Freedom in a "Lensman Arms Race" against an unknown Gundam. We know it can't possibly Destiny or Legend since they were both easily defeated, so it has to be a Gundam from another universe (Which in the end may have been the Hi-Nu, V2, Wing Zero, DX, and recently the 00 Raiser). Either that or its explaining why was the SF able to kick the Destiny's and Legend's asses so easily. I wouldn't be surprised if they give the new Freedom in the upcoming movie a special system that boosts the Freedom's performance more than three times its usual specs for a limited amount of time.

They series also mentioned that Kira was THE Ultimate Coordinator, which many fans were lead to believe that he was some kind of a Newtype super pilot. In reality, the term Ultimate Coordinator meant that he came out the way Dr. Hibiki intended. It makes me wonder if Dr.Hibiki had actually intended to create a Newtype + SEED Factor hybrid since Al Da Flaga's DNA might have been involved and Canard Pars was just one the failures who attained ESP but not the SEED Factor. Like Soul Bro mentioned, they never explain any of that in the series (at least I don't think they do in other source materials like the Astray mangas or other source materials). As mentioned above (if you even consider it to be canon or not), it says that the pilot had to be something along the lines of a "Super Coordinator" to pull off the "Full Burst" attack of the Strike Freedom.


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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:52 pm 
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I had heard the something about Kira being a Super Coordinator but thought it was a little crazy since Canard, a failed Ultimate Coordinator, is described as a Super Coordinator. So did Fukuda not read the X Astray manga or is there some other reason for this?

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 6:12 pm 
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To MindlessFire:
--"Yes I would completely agree. But for some odd reasons the model kits kept retconning things about Strike Freedom like the “Voiture Lumière” system found similarly in the Destiny therefore allowing it generate afterimages just like the F91 was now also on the Strike Freedom. And then they add the fact the SF's golden joints are used to endure ultra-mobility beyond the limits of its design. The manual of the Master Grade 1/100 model kit says that activating HiMAT Full Burst mode and the Super DRAGOONs at the same time was virtually impossible unless the pilot was some sort of a super coordinator. When using its Voiture Lumiere to travel at high speeds, it's the Phase Shift Armor that's actually holds the mobile suit together."--

Except none of this is shown or even implied in the animation, where the Strike Freedom performs and acts exactly the same as the Freedom. The only added features were flashy lights and more guns. Hardly worth the effort of all that technology, if you ask me.

Edit: Damn BBCode...

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 Post Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:07 am 
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Louise in S2 kind of of reminded me of Shinn. They were both victims of war and witness their families killed in front of them. I guess the difference was Louise's joined ALAWS because she wanted to create a unified world without any wars because she was a victim of war. When the Gundams returned, her biggest motivation for fighting is to defeat the Gundams and Celestial Being to avenge her family. I couldn't really understand why Shinn joined ZAFT other than he wanted "Power" or whatever. Why did Shinn join ZAFT again?


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 Post Posted: Sat May 23, 2009 12:52 am 
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ZeonsSilverStar wrote:
I had heard the something about Kira being a Super Coordinator but thought it was a little crazy since Canard, a failed Ultimate Coordinator, is described as a Super Coordinator. So did Fukuda not read the X Astray manga or is there some other reason for this?


Probably not. A lot of creators don't take into account side story material when they are working on what they consider "His or Her" universe. The small hints linking Astray and Gundam probably came about more from other individuals involved in the project rather then conscious effort by Fukuda.

Otherwise, you would probably have seen more concrete links considering how using elements and characters from the Astray stories would have helped in areas of SEED and DESTINY where the story was obviously stalling.


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 Post Posted: Sat May 23, 2009 1:54 am 
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Wellman wrote:
ZeonsSilverStar wrote:
I had heard the something about Kira being a Super Coordinator but thought it was a little crazy since Canard, a failed Ultimate Coordinator, is described as a Super Coordinator. So did Fukuda not read the X Astray manga or is there some other reason for this?


Probably not. A lot of creators don't take into account side story material when they are working on what they consider "His or Her" universe. The small hints linking Astray and Gundam probably came about more from other individuals involved in the project rather then conscious effort by Fukuda.

Otherwise, you would probably have seen more concrete links considering how using elements and characters from the Astray stories would have helped in areas of SEED and DESTINY where the story was obviously stalling.

I looked this up since it was sorta bothering me but its something that I can still accept since Kira is still the only succesful Super Coordinator so if Canard is a failed one then he technically is not a Super Coordinator but a Coordinator nonetheless.

As for the director not reading the manga, there was no way he could have. Astray X began running in late 2003 and by that time Gundam Seed had just finished its run by a mere 1 to two months and that information regarding Canard wasn't given till later on.

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 Post Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 12:15 am 
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Wellman wrote:
ZeonsSilverStar wrote:
I had heard the something about Kira being a Super Coordinator but thought it was a little crazy since Canard, a failed Ultimate Coordinator, is described as a Super Coordinator. So did Fukuda not read the X Astray manga or is there some other reason for this?


Probably not. A lot of creators don't take into account side story material when they are working on what they consider "His or Her" universe. The small hints linking Astray and Gundam probably came about more from other individuals involved in the project rather then conscious effort by Fukuda.

Otherwise, you would probably have seen more concrete links considering how using elements and characters from the Astray stories would have helped in areas of SEED and DESTINY where the story was obviously stalling.


I don't know why I didn't take the whole its a side story thing into consideration. I also should've doublechecked the dates like Red Comet90 mentioned. Anyway would've been nice if it had been included in the main story.

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 Post Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:56 pm 
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Chris summed up a fair ammount of my thoughts on Destiny, to a point it was good, but then the 180 turn didn't help.
If I had done the show, I would have kept Shinn in, maybe it would have been nice to see the 3 ships Alliance do something near the end and maybe perhaps they could obtain victory but not without suffering losses or huge ammount of damage to their ships.
Strike Freedom getting somewhat trashed maybe.
Destiny maybe actually equally mauling Infinite Justice and not being so one sided.
I would also have had something interesting like say if Kira's Strike Freedom got trashed he would come back out in the Strike Rouge in the Strike Gundam colours with IWSP pack against Shinn in the Impulse(just to keep things at least interesting)

I also was surprised Austin didn't get why Shinn joined the military it makes perfect sense to me and it seems silly of him to go and say Shinn should have joinned Orb's millitary.
When Orb were the ones who acted defiantly to the Alliance and got invaded by the Alliance which resulted in events leading up to Shinn's family being killed in cross fire.

Also as for Shinn and his obsession with Freedom, I'll have to rewatch sometime.
But I disagree that, the perception was changed later on, it just means what the viewer saw was a different angle.
Doesn't mean things went the same way, no.
But it does mean Freedom still had a part and that was the last thing Shinn remembers seeing flying overhead loudly.

I could go on more about Destiny but yeah, it needs a whole rewrite, from about episode 38-40.
Pretty much after the Destroy attack in Berlin and Operation Angel Down.
On a small note I forgot to add earlier, Chris Strike Freedom did take some damage it lost like 1-2 DRAGOONs didn't it?


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