CE Beams

[CYNICISM AT IT'S BEST]

that would be......odd, matter from light, wait that could mean we could have replicators!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Green-san]

Waves and Particles have a lot in common, unlike common opinions, and scientificly you CAN transform light into matter... So yeah, I guess we could(?)

One thing, though... What's a replicator?^^"

[Hyakushiki]

One thing, though... What's a replicator?^^"

In the Star Trek universe, a Repilcator can create almost anything by converting energy into solid matter.

[Green-san]

Oh.... Well, we have a long way to go 'till then

But... perhaps it will be possible...

[toysdream]

The Duality Principle that every wave can be translated as particle and the opposite, so theoraticaly you can translate light into matter, as well, and since light is a form of energy, can't you translate energy into matter?

"Particle" is not the same thing as "matter." Light can be treated as a particle, but those particles don't have any mass and are therefore not matter. As per Einstein's equation, you can convert matter into energy and vice versa, but you're converting between two different things that are not the same.

Once again, when matter and anti-matter collide, their mass is converted into light and radiation. They cease to be matter (or anti-matter) and are changed into energy. Energy itself is not a form of matter. This is pretty fundamental to modern physics.

-- Mark

[Green-san]

I get the all Antimatter+Matter=Energy, what I don't understand is - why can't the light "particle" be of any volume of mass? As far as my education goes, atoms are constructed from particles, and these particles gives it its mass, so they must have mass as well.

If that is correct then why can't light particles have mass as well?

[toysdream]

I get the all Antimatter+Matter=Energy, what I don't understand is - why can't the light "particle" be of any volume of mass? As far as my education goes, atoms are constructed from particles, and these particles gives it its mass, so they must have mass as well.

If that is correct then why can't light particles have mass as well?

Some particles have mass, and some don't. The precise scientific term here is "rest mass"; a particle with greater than zero rest mass contains matter, and a particle with zero rest mass (like the photons which make up light) doesn't. Both kinds of particle behave in similar ways, but only the former counts as matter.

-- Mark

[Green-san]

"Rest mass"... Never heard of it. If you say so than it makes sense, I guess, and Laser Beams really AREN'T like Positron Beams... That would also explain why they achieve such different things... And work differently than one another...

Energy and Matter... Matter and Energy...

[stormturmoil]

To further qualify a point:

It IS possible to convert energy in the form of Light (or, in theory, any other electromagnetic wave) into matter - and it's been done.

In a high energy Laser laboratory, Scientists experimented with firing two high energy laser beams into each other at 90 degrees.

Now this is one of those weird instances where light's particle nature really shows more than the wave (the other major one being the photoelectric effect).

Rather than simply pass through each other like you'd expect them to do if they were wholly wave phenomena, the Beams collided, and the energy was converted to matter and antimatter particle pairs - creating one each of a particle and it's anti-particle - which were spun off in a vector that was the resultant vector of the two beams intersecting in what has been termed an 'absorbic' reaction.

[toysdream]

Rather than simply pass through each other like you'd expect them to do if they were wholly wave phenomena, the Beams collided, and the energy was converted to matter and antimatter particle pairs - creating one each of a particle and it's anti-particle - which were spun off in a vector that was the resultant vector of the two beams intersecting in what has been termed an 'absorbic' reaction.

Cool! I guess this is basically a matter-antimatter collision running in reverse, turning energy into matter instead of vice versa.

-- Mark

[Sabersonic]

It IS possible to convert energy in the form of Light (or, in theory, any other electromagnetic wave) into matter - and it's been done.

In a high energy Laser laboratory, Scientists experimented with firing two high energy laser beams into each other at 90 degrees.

Now this is one of those weird instances where light's particle nature really shows more than the wave (the other major one being the photoelectric effect).

Rather than simply pass through each other like you'd expect them to do if they were wholly wave phenomena, the Beams collided, and the energy was converted to matter and antimatter particle pairs - creating one each of a particle and it's anti-particle - which were spun off in a vector that was the resultant vector of the two beams intersecting in what has been termed an 'absorbic' reaction.

Interesting, but do you have the source of such a discovery on hand? We don't want to jump on the band wagon prematurely.

Anyway onto the subject at hand, though the green beams of the CE universe do apparently show the characteristics of lasers, however they do show the affects of particles (atomic, sub-atomic, take your pick) when these Directed Energy Rounds are bent towards a different vector when fired at the Geschmeidig Panzer. My physics may be off, but I don't remember much on experiments that involve bending light via magnetic fields and gas to such a dramatic degree. Diffuse, maybe, but not bend the entire beam of light.

[Gadget]

It is theortical possible to convert energy to matter base on the E=mc2. This is the principal of the teleporters, or transporters in Star Trek. But all this stuff is still science fiction and Hollywood.

And bending light is possible, by Albert Einstine, but it involes gravity. And I mean lots of gravity, like Neutron Star or Black Hole. But the Geschmeidig Panzer is not gravity base, or all attacking units would have been squashed. It's more likely electo-magantic. So a charge beam, like ion or plasma is used. But not laser.

If you think that is funky, how about explaining a few Zaku Gunners could combine their beam into a TBR like mega beam. So instead of cross-crossing like a laser show, they got diverted into a larger coherent beam. This happen when ZAFT were attacking on of the Geschmeidig Panzer.

[toysdream]

Anyway onto the subject at hand, though the green beams of the CE universe do apparently show the characteristics of lasers, however they do show the affects of particles (atomic, sub-atomic, take your pick) when these Directed Energy Rounds are bent towards a different vector when fired at the Geschmeidig Panzer. My physics may be off, but I don't remember much on experiments that involve bending light via magnetic fields and gas to such a dramatic degree.

It's not the magnetic field that bends the beams. The Geschmeidig Panzer is supposedly based on Mirage Colloid, which is made up of tiny prisms that bend light around the mobile suit's body. Geschmeidig Panzer presumably just does the same thing to beams, whatever they're made of.

In the case of the Forbidden Gundam, we know that it can bend the beams of its own plasma cannon using only a magnetic field. (The field is generated between the barrels of its two railguns.) Whatever regular beams are made of, then, it's presumably something that can't be deflected by a magnetic field or the Geschmeidig Panzer wouldn't be necessary in the first place.

On the whole, the case of the Forbidden Gundam, which indicates that standard beams can't be deflected by a magnetic field alone but can be deflected by a technology derived from light-bending prisms, seems to support the laser theory. But there's evidence in the other direction, too, and we still don't have a definitive answer. At some point we should probably give up and move on to pondering the mechanics of the GN particle.

-- Mark

[DeltasTaii]

Anti-ship swords sort of make sense of it, I suppose.

Sword Calamity per se, has green beams both from its blades and from what are actually stated to be lasers fired from it. Buuut, Sword Strike also uses presumably the same kind of laser blade (both are Schwert Gwehrer or whatever, IIRC), and that one's pink like a beam saber. Not that beam sabers couldn't equally have stationary lasers I suppose, given the colloid application.

The necessary leap is probably to categorize large green beams as particle weapons like the GINN's cannon, since ships rather distinctly dodge Nazca class main cannons and the Archangel's Gottfrieds, etc. Considering that there's little if any animation difference between a plasma, or multi-phase cannon to name a couple, that may just work. After that, you pretty much have to right off avoiding beam rifles in the same way as people dodging bullets, coordinators or not.

[minovskycore_0180er]

After I created my topic on the Lonhengrin Positron Cannon Green-san told me about your thread and after seeing your threads I look at Wiki - not for Gundam - but for anything in modern day weaponry that could relate to positron based weapons. I did find these.

Storage Devices:
Positron Storage- Fullerene
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fullerene

Sub-Atomic Particle Storage-Peening Trap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penning_trap

This also contains a example as to how a antimatter reaction might take place.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimatter_weapon

And some examples of annihilation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annihilation

And electron-positron annihilation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electron-p ... nihilation

[minovskycore_0180er]

And anything that takes up physical space is matter. Matter is merely energy condensed to a small vibration. So, quite frankly the clothes that you adorn yourself with everyday is energy. Your body is energy that has a vibration that has been slowed to point that it can be called solid matter. However, this doesn't exactly pertain to some particles as they are quasi-neutral. Quasi-neutral meaning that within ionized and gaseous form the positive and negative charges are practically identical.

Which might explain Mirage Colloid's effectiveness. By designing a MS armor that's based on 45 degree angled surfaces that modern stealth aircraft use and a gas cloud that is virtually chargeless radar waves could be easily repelled by the armor and a redundecy of ionized gaseous could disrupt incoming radar waves. Prism then reflect and refract light to and frow while a powerful EMF created by the Blitz could bend the light around it. But I'm completely off topic.

But particles and their weight are based on the periodic table of elements. Hydrogen accounting as the value of 1. After which you have sub-atomic particles. However sub-atomic unit's are made of quantum units known as quantum particles or "Quarks" . Some of these are: Muon's, Gluon's, Phonon's, Meson's, Boson's, Photon's, Kaon's, all the way down to the Higg's Particle which is theorized to be the smallest particle in existence. This is why some particles can be registered as -0.0 and on in atomic weight. There also exists anti-particles that pertain to the quantum particle scale, such as the Kaon. That is and anti-material form of one of the four meson families. It is a strange quark also called a K-meson. If you going to debate about particles you might want to check out the list of quantum particles I've listed and find out their nature of existence.

[toysdream]

And anything that takes up physical space is matter. Matter is merely energy condensed to a small vibration. So, quite frankly the clothes that you adorn yourself with everyday is energy.

If you're saying that matter and energy are the same thing, then I'm sorry, it's your word against Albert Einstein and the entire structure of modern physics.

However sub-atomic unit's are made of quantum units known as quantum particles or "Quarks" . Some of these are: Muon's, Gluon's, Phonon's, Meson's, Boson's, Photon's, Kaon's, all the way down to the Higg's Particle which is theorized to be the smallest particle in existence.

You know, none of these are quarks. Photons and phonons aren't even matter, and most of the rest of these are elementary particles which are made of quarks.

But look, all this remedial physics is getting silly. We've spent a couple of days here trying to establish a fundamental scientific definition that barely had anything to with the topic in the first place. I think I'm done here.

-- Mark