Dopp Effectiveness

[RX 93 ZZ]

How were the Dopps effectiveness pre-V project and post V Project?

Also were there ever any upgraded dopps after the OYW?

[Phantomexe87]

I imagine when used in coordination with mobile suits and Gaw Carriers, they must have been quite successful, but by the time of MSG they were little more than a glorified annoyance.

I figure after the OYW, the few Zeon remnants probably kept some Dopps as scouts and did some routine upgrades, but they'd all be customized jobs. The republic of Zeon's small standing army, has no use for them, so I imagine the Dopp never saw any official upgrades. It is possible, that given the Federation's penchant for using Zeon engineering, that the Federation made their own dopp-like fighter, but that's pure speculation.

[razgriz]

it seemed like the feds had their own better performing (and better looking) fighters later on in the OYW and beyond but its also conceivable that those jets were possible thanks to captured or reverse engineered dopps. geez those things were ugly though hehe

[mcred23]

but its also conceivable that those jets were possible thanks to captured or reverse engineered dopps.

I don't think so. Given that all the Federation fighters we know and love (Saberfish, TIN Cod, Fly Manta, etc) were all developed and built before the OYW (And thus, before the Federation would have it's hands on a Dopp), I doubt they used any of the Dopps features or weapons in it.

As for the Dopp's effectiveness, it's pretty much a light littler fighter ment to be used in a war with Minovsky Particles, which IIRC is partly why it has that exposed (But view offering) cockpit. It's probably alright against other fighters, but it's weapons are really too light for serious ground attack missions. What may also speak to it's effectiveness against EFAF pilots are that two men, Texan Demitry and Major Samuela, scored over 300 kills against the largely-made-up-of-Dopps Zeon air units.

As for post war units, the Republic Of Zeon probably had no need for the Dopp anymore, period, seeing how they'd withdrawn from Earth. I wouldn't be suprised if they never upgraded any of their Dopps, or if they got rid of most of them by some means. Now, with so many Zeon remnants on Earth, I'd think a few were in use somewhere, but if they were to be upgraded, to expand on what Phantomexe87 said, they'd be customized jobs that probably never got outside of whatever little unit they were in.

[razgriz]

i did like the 12 missile/rocket launcher cannon pods though, it could definitely do some damage in the ground assault role with a missile spamming pass. of course this is assuming its going against a troop formation or light armor, its royally f'd if it had to go against say a ground gm.

[Jynx]

I never understood why air power had so little effect on the ground battles fought by Zeon and the Federation during the OYW.

First of all, the Dopp and it's Feddy counterparts are jet fighters, they move quickly, and even with computer aided aiming, we know that in our world ground based anti-aircraft cannon fire is generally ineffective unless slaved to an companion radar.

How would the aiming be affected by heavy dispersions of M particles? We know that M particles inhibit or degrade the quality of most sensors, which is why combat in the OYW is fought largely within sight.

Thus...

A pilot in a GM shooting at a high speed fighter who is trained avoid flak, seems to have a pitiful chance of shooting down the craft without expending large amounts of ammunition and exposing him/herself to unnecessary reprisal from the Dopp's squadron mates.

So solution to make the Dopp more effective? Give it a centerline high velocity 30mm cannon designed for armor penetration, and remove the existing cannons. Expand the cockpit to allow a weapons officer who can aim wire-guided missiles.

A concerted Dopp attack seems like it would easily be able to make itself cost effective in destroying enemy MS. MS are big targets, with the ability for a fighter to maneuver in a three dimensional environment to avoid enemy fire and launch missiles from within maximum visibility, why wouldn't they be highly effective?

Just my .02

[Oruma]

In-universe, EFF air force DID make its impact in halting the Zeon advances across the globe. The problem may be that they don't have the ground force to secure their hold on the territory, when you remember that locals may be pro-EFF, dissidents or Zeon collaborators.

Out-of-universe, Air forces (fighter planes) and Ground forces (tanks) are shown to be ineffective in the Gundam universe only because of dramatic reasons. How else can you justify using these giant robots roaming the place?

[mcred23]

Yeah, the Earth Federation Air Force actually was quite effective against the Zeon forces on Earth, particularly later in the war. And by the time the GM's started rolling out in major numbers, the EFAF basically owed the skies accross the world, meaning the type of attack Jynx outlined would doubtlessly face numerious, often experianced, EFAF units (And would thus really screw things up).

[J-Lead]

I'm not sure why people like to say that Fighter planes are shown to be ineffective in the Gundam Universe. The EFAF actually played a huge role in almost every major terrestrial offensive, usually just as big a role as MS played, or, sometimes, an even bigger one (California Base, Odessa, and the Mountain offensive in 08th MS Team are good examples of this trend.) Sure, they are sometimes portrayed as a little, well, ineffective at times, but it's usually when they are going up against an experianced veteran like Norris or a miracle working Newtype-to-be like early-mid MSG Amuro. Even Shiro Amada had to waste almost an entire clip of 100mm ammunition to shoot down a single Dopp Fighter, and that was after he had seriously disoriented the pilot with a smokescreen (who, interestingly enough, turned out to be Norris Packard, his second defeat out of three at the hands of Shiro.)