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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:36 am 
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I'm trying to figure out exactly how many Newtype Mobile Weapons did the Principality of Zeon managed to built during the OYW and if we can identify their pilots. Some of these production numbers were already mentioned in another thread.

Let's start with the Newtype MS:

-MS-06Z- 3 were produced, out of which one was destroyed and one was upgraded into the MSN-01. One piloted by Yahagi Franziback as briefly seen on a Flashback on Ecole du Ciel.
-MSN-01- 1 upgraded from a MS-06Z. A second blue unit is seen in A Baoa Qu in the Gundam Crisis attraction (possibly upgraded from the other MS-06Z).
-MSN-02- 3 produced, out of which one was only 80% complete and this particualr unit was piloted by Char Aznable. In CDA, Char pilots another 100% complete unit. Possibly irrelevant, but there is a model kit of a MSN-02R, which is a 80% complete Zeon equipped with backapck with wing like thrusters.

Now the Newtype MA:

-MAN-03- the previous thread indicates that only 2 wereproduced, however there could have been more: 1- Prototype unit controlled by non-newtype Simus Al Baharkov and her crew, 2- Challia Bull's unit, 3- Unit controlled by Mallet Sanguine non-newtype troops (Lilia Flaubert) 4- Unit seen during Gihren's speech at A Baoa Qu.
-MAN-05- At first it was though this unit was not produced due to costs and technological limitations. However it seems that one unit appeared in the Gundam Katana sidestory, though I don't know any details, but we do know that it's unlikely that Zeon remanats were able to built it on their own.
-MAN-08- 3 units produced. According to Gundam Century, the first unit's bits went out of control and destroyed it. The second unit was piloted by Lalah Sune. In the novel, the last Elmeth Unit was piloted by Cusco Al.

A special mention goes to the MS-08TX(EXAM) which according to Gihren's Greed seems to have been also developed by the Flanagan Institute (at least it is mentioned as one of the requirements).

As for known newtype pilots:
-Char Aznable (MSN-02)
-Lalah Sune (MAN-08)
-Cusco Al (MAN-08)*
-Challia Bull (MAN-03)
-Yahagi Franziback (MS-06Z)**
-Marion Welch (MS-08TX(EXAM))***

Unknown pilots:
-Pilots of the 2 remaining MS-06Z (one killed)
-Pilots of th other 2 Zeongs.
-Pilot of the first Elmeth unit (killed during test)
-Pilot of the Braw Bro seen at A Baoa Qu

*Only seen in the novel.

**With the destruction of one of the 3 original MS-06Z, there's a 50% chance that he also piloted the MSN-01. After that, he seems a likely candidate to be the pilot of one of the two other Zeongs or the Braw Bro seen at A Baoa Qu.

***Marion entered a comma when the EXAM system was created. When the system activates, she seems to take control of the units isntalled with EXAM. She supposedly regained consciousness after the destruction of all remaining EXAM units, which happens on the middle of December. Afterwards, she may have been able to participate in the final battles, piloting either a Zeong or the Braw Bro seen at A Baoa Qu.

With all this said:
-Does anyone know any other Zeon OYW Newtype pilots?
-How complete were the other Zeongs? Were they deployed in combat in the OYW?
-For those who have been following Gundam Katana: Can you please share any information you ahve on the MAN-05?
-Can the MAN-03's remote weapons be properly controlled by non-newtypes as suggested in the TV series and the Space, To the End of A Flash sidestory?
-Anyone has some backgroud info on the blue MSN-01 seen in Gundam Crisis?

Comments and corrections are welcome.


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 5:03 pm 
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A first set of additions to your very fine Zeon NT-use MW list can be as follows:

- MAN-00X Bartizado (original katakana: バチザード), the very first NT use version of the MA-04X, which, as far as I know is only mentioned in a rather obscure booklet;
- MAN-00X-2 Brarello (original katakana: ブラレロ), the improvement of the above-mentioned one, directly from the 28th Gundam Ace installment of MSV-R;
- MAN-06 Freischutz (original katakana: フライシュッツ), an high-speed pink-colored MA appeared in the october 1997 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07 Garaume (original katakana: ガローメ) from the june 1996 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07-B Garo Buran (original katakana: ガロ・ブラン) from the june 1996 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07-N Garo Nowal (original katakana: ガロ・ノワル) from a 1998 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MS-06NT2 Zaku Newtype Experiment Use (original Japanese: NT実験用ザク), again from RPG Magazine (this time from RPG Magazine Great vol.3);
- MSN-01 Kikeroga (or Ciqueroga as sometimes it's spelled; original katakana: キケロガ; other reported model numers are MSN-N01 and MSN-X1) a mobile suit originally planned to be used by Char in the first series, and ultimately appeared only in the SD G-Generation series games (from G-Generation Zero onwards);
- MSN-03-2 Great Zeong, the ultimate form of the Zeong, introduced by G-Generation Spirits.

Concerning the pilots of these (and other not mentioned) oddities, for the moment I can mention only Number 4 (on the MS-06NT2), but perhaps with more digging other names will appear :D


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:54 pm 
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Thanks for the addition bilbros. I can't believe I forgot to add the Brarello considering that I have recently checked the MSV-R thread. I also knew about the Kikeroga, however I didn't know that it had other model numbers besides MSN-01, which it shares with the High Mobility Psycommu Zaku, which is the main reason while at first I didn't want include it since it seemed that it was repalced by said unit. As for the other units, I hadn't heard about, but it's quite interesting to see that there are actually many units filling the gap between the Braw Bro and the Elmeth.

On the other hand, I finally remembered another Newtype pilot: Leroy Gilliam

He is the one that shoots down Amuro in the novel and one of the few survivors of the original Newtype Corps.

I have also checked around wikipedia and other sources, and found an odd claim which includes Haman Karn among the their test subjects along with Lalah Sune, Cusco Al and Marion Welch, although it also includes Char and Challia Bull, which we know for certain weren't among their test subjects. But just to be sure, does anyone know if there is any information about Haman Karn during the OYW?


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:57 pm 
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Haman would've been all of 12 in 0079. I doubt that she had much to do with the One Year War.

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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:39 pm 
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Actually she would have been 10 years old (Char says she is 18 on U.C. 0087). And yet, she wouldn't be the youngest test subject out there in the OYW. Let's not forget about all those kids from the last episode of 08th MS team and Asuna Elmarit from Ecole du Ciel, who would have been 8 years old in the OYW. Much later on is Elpeo Puru, who by the age of 10 is already being deployed in combat. Finally we have Quess Paraya who is 13 years old on Char's Counterattack.

Anyway, age doesn't seem to be a limiting factor, either for being a test subject or being deployed in combat.

All that said, the question remains if there is anything that might indicate Haman's involvement with the Flanagan Institute during the OYW.

I might be straying a bit here, but I read that in the Gihren's Greed games there are several Cyber Newtypes that join Zeon at some point, starting with Proto Zero or Zero Murasame, Leila Raymond or NT-001, NT-002, NT-003 and NT-004. Anyone has any information on them, such as when do they first appear or where did their enhancement took place at?


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:54 am 
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They won't really help you in getting Zeon OYW Newtype pilots as they are all only exist in the post OYW scenarios. They are all original game creations. Proto Zero first appeared in the Saturn version and the rest appeared in the PS version.

Proto Zero (Zero Mursasame) was affiliated with the Titans and was created as the Murasame institute the name is a dead give away from that. Proto Zero will run away from the Titans with the Prototype Mark II and joins the Zeon side. He runs in Leyla and goes into some rant to Gihren about canceling the Artificial Newtype research and what not.

Leyla Ramyond (NT-001) was created at Flanagan institute according to her profile in the game.

NT-002, NT-003 and NT-004 are just nameless/faceless/voiceless pilots all created using the data of Leyla and done by Flanagan institute.

Basically the way the game works for Zeon is you either accept Proto Zero's request of stopping the research and not get NT-002, NT-003, NT-004 but Proto and Leyla stay, or you don't in which case he takes Leyla and runs off to the EF but you get NT-002, NT-003 and NT-004.

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:34 pm 
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Quote:
Anyway, age doesn't seem to be a limiting factor, either for being a test subject or being deployed in combat.

I agree. After all, in the manga C.D.A. we're told that Kamzi (one of the youngest characters featuring there) piloted a MS in the OYW when she was still a child...
Speaking of Haman, the idea of her as a member of Zeon's NT corps derives at least from Monoeye Gundams, where the future leader of Neo Zeon pilots a white Elmeth (which is said to be unit n.3, whereas in Gather Beat this same machine is identified as unit 2).
By the way, the mentioned game has another noticeable newtype girl, Serein Experi (nicknamed "Sera"), who uses a red MAN-08 (the unit n.4).


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:43 pm 
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Gelgoog Jager wrote:
Actually she would have been 10 years old (Char says she is 18 on U.C. 0087).

When is that? Gundam Official lists her as 20 during Zeta.

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:31 pm 
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bilbros wrote:
Speaking of Haman, the idea of her as a member of Zeon's NT corps derives at least from Monoeye Gundams, where the future leader of Neo Zeon pilots a white Elmeth (which is said to be unit n.3, whereas in Gather Beat this same machine is identified as unit 2).


Games are notorious for taking liberties with established facts in the name of fan service. G Generation is especially aggressive in how it takes liberties to justify certain villain team ups or antagonists-turned-allies.

Simply put, I doubt Haman had anything to do with Zeon's Newtype program circa 0079.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:02 am 
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Brave Fencer Kirby wrote:
Gelgoog Jager wrote:
Actually she would have been 10 years old (Char says she is 18 on U.C. 0087).

When is that? Gundam Official lists her as 20 during Zeta.


My bad, you are right about her being twenty. I thought Char said she was 18 when he first received the info about Axis heading back to the Earth Sphere, but I just confirmed that he indeed says twenty. Sorry for the misunderstanding.


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 2:35 pm 
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I think here is a storyline on how Zero and Leyla will join your AEUG side if you help with some research on fixing him up... but my memory may not be correct.

aNYHOW HE DOES PILOT A PROTOTYPE mk-ii and is basically a staple character in the series. Well at least I am happily using him in my game currently.

Mark064 wrote:
They won't really help you in getting Zeon OYW Newtype pilots as they are all only exist in the post OYW scenarios. They are all original game creations. Proto Zero first appeared in the Saturn version and the rest appeared in the PS version.

Proto Zero (Zero Mursasame) was affiliated with the Titans and was created as the Murasame institute the name is a dead give away from that. Proto Zero will run away from the Titans with the Prototype Mark II and joins the Zeon side. He runs in Leyla and goes into some rant to Gihren about canceling the Artificial Newtype research and what not.

Leyla Ramyond (NT-001) was created at Flanagan institute according to her profile in the game.

NT-002, NT-003 and NT-004 are just nameless/faceless/voiceless pilots all created using the data of Leyla and done by Flanagan institute.

Basically the way the game works for Zeon is you either accept Proto Zero's request of stopping the research and not get NT-002, NT-003, NT-004 but Proto and Leyla stay, or you don't in which case he takes Leyla and runs off to the EF but you get NT-002, NT-003 and NT-004.


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:39 pm 
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Thanks for the replies so far.

Imperial wrote:
bilbros wrote:
Speaking of Haman, the idea of her as a member of Zeon's NT corps derives at least from Monoeye Gundams, where the future leader of Neo Zeon pilots a white Elmeth (which is said to be unit n.3, whereas in Gather Beat this same machine is identified as unit 2).


Games are notorious for taking liberties with established facts in the name of fan service. G Generation is especially aggressive in how it takes liberties to justify certain villain team ups or antagonists-turned-allies.

Simply put, I doubt Haman had anything to do with Zeon's Newtype program circa 0079.


IIRC, Elmeth unit 1 was destroyed during a test after its bits went out of control and attacked the MA. This would mean that Lalah's unit is probably unit 2. As for unit 3, in the novels Cusco Al pilots another Elmeth after Lalah has been killed, so it's a possibility to consider her the pilot of that unit. If this is indeed the pilot fate/pilot assignement of the 3 units, we can definitely discard Haman as one of the pilots, unless we consider that she repalced Cusco Al as the pilot of unit 3.

bilbros wrote:
By the way, the mentioned game has another noticeable newtype girl, Serein Experi (nicknamed "Sera"), who uses a red MAN-08 (the unit n.4).


In another thread Mark indicated that only 3 Elmeths were produced, but so were we told that only 9 Zaku Cannons were produced and now everything points towards far more of them being built, so I would be willing to accept that at some point Zeon decided to produce a fourth unit of a MA as succesful as the Elmeth, especially if they identified a possible pilot for it, which seemed to be one of the major problems Zeon had regarding their Newtype weapons. On the other hand, I can't help but think that a red Elmeth would have been built with the intention of having Char as its pilot.

bilbros:

If possible, can you please give us some more information about Serein Experi and Elmeth unit 4, especially regarding on when was it first deployed?

Also, do you have any image or background information of these units:

bilbros wrote:
- MAN-00X Bartizado (original katakana: バチザード), the very first NT use version of the MA-04X, which, as far as I know is only mentioned in a rather obscure booklet;
- MAN-06 Freischutz (original katakana: フライシュッツ), an high-speed pink-colored MA appeared in the october 1997 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07 Garaume (original katakana: ガローメ) from the june 1996 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07-B Garo Buran (original katakana: ガロ・ブラン) from the june 1996 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MAN-07-N Garo Nowal (original katakana: ガロ・ノワル) from a 1998 issue of RPG Magazine;
- MS-06NT2 Zaku Newtype Experiment Use (original Japanese: NT実験用ザク), again from RPG Magazine (this time from RPG Magazine Great vol.3);


Enileph:

It sounds unfortunate that you can't keep all 5 cyber-newtypes. Just out of curiosity: do you know what's the largest number of newtype pilots that any of the factions from the Gihren's Greed series can have at one a time?


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:58 pm 
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The red Elmeth and its pilot (rendered as "Seleyn Ixpery" on MAHQ) are from Monoeye Gundams, I believe, which makes for another case of video game shenanigans.

I wouldn't put too much stock into it if I were you, but, if you really want to be that exact about this, I do know it was present at the Battle of A Baoa Qu. I believe it was also a part of the Newtype Corps, operating independently of Char and his Zeong rampage. Whatever the case, the Elmeth didn't contribute to the battle in any major way thanks to the revelation that wing man Ein Levi was actually a Federation spy. He shot down the Elmeth and a Rick Dom piloted by Monoeye Gundams protagonist Siegfried Wedner.

Sieg survives and turns up seven years later with the AEUG, while Ein has become a big shot in the Titans. Seleyn also shows up as a mostly mindless attack drone, having been brainwashed into serving the Titans.

The three of them were candidates for the titular Monoeye Gundams, a set of powerful mobile suits meant to create weapons comparable to Gundam and capable of turning the tide of the war. This plan never came to fruition with the Zeon's premature defeat, although the Federation did acquire the plans and put them into production for themselves (much like the Galbaldy) just in time for the video game's version of the Gryps War. Seleyn's unit, the Tera S'Ono, is a Newtype-use transformable mobile suit-mobile armor. I believe Ein's Dezpada may be Newtype-use as well, but I'm a bit shakier on that one.

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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 3:04 pm 
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Quote:
If possible, can you please give us some more information about Serein Experi and Elmeth unit 4, especially regarding on when was it first deployed?

Also, do you have any image or background information of these units: [...]


Well, concerning the red MAN-08 and related subjects, Imperial already gave an excellent report.

As regards the other units for which images and details are requested, most of them came from RPG Magazine issues which I don't have, and are not treated elsewhere: therefore, the only thing I can do is providing "second hand" information essentially (but non exclusively) based on some usually reliable on-line sources such as the older, non Wiki-like version of MS Lexicon and its now-disappeared "brother" Gundam World Encyclopedia.

- MAN-00X Batizado (not Bartizado, which is a typo; the name derives from the Portuguese, and means "baptized").
This is a two-seater experimental upgrade of the MA-04X Zakrello, developed by the MIP company in the final stages of the OYW. The mecha has a pair of mono-eyes replacing the original original compound ones; moreover, it's separable in two parts which can fight independently.
Its armaments consist in a couple of wireless mono-eye bit (original katakana: モノアイビット) provided of a small beam cannon each, intended for long-range remote warfare, and two wire-guided attack bit (original Japanese: 攻撃ビット) for close-combats. The former are housed in the "mouth" of the MA (where the Zakrello had the scattering beam cannon), while the latter replace the infamous heat nata (i.e. the arm blades).
As soon as the prototype was completed, it was scheduled also to mount on it an I-field barrier generator, but apparently this remained only on the paper.
I don't know whether a depiction of this mobile armor do exist or not (although my bets are for the second option).

- MAN-06 Freischutz.
The only available depiction of this mecha can be found on the old version of MS Lexicon: the overall aspect reminds a Grublo with the claws of a Bigro.
Not much info can be added: as already said, this is a pink-colored high speed MA, and the model number suggests that it's intended to be used by Newtypes. Its armaments are a couple of 8-tube large missile pods, plus the already-mentioned iron claws. The pilot is named (believe it or not) Rocky Horror Show (original katakana: ラッキー・ホラー・ショウ) :?

- MAN-07 Garaume, MAN-07-B Garo Buran, MAN-07-N Garo Nowal.
All these featured in the RPG story titled "Gundam Kabard: the scales of Nemesis" (original Japanese: ガンダム・カバード ネメシスの天秤).
Actually, here we're dealing with a single mecha, since the Garaume is formed by the combination of the Garo Buran [a white MA, armed with 3 bit and claws for close combat; the pilot is Mio Castarica (original katakana: ミオ・キャスタリカ)] and the Garo Nowal [a black MA, armed with one bit, an 8-tube anti-MS missile pod and enhanced claws; the pilot is Mio's twin, Teo Castarica (original katakana: テオ・キャスタリカ)].
No images available.

- MS-06NT2 Zaku Newtype Experiment Use.
This silver-colored variant of Zaku II is armed with three bit, a 380mm bazooka and a beam saber. Its pilot is named Number 4 (original katakana: ナンバー4).
Once again, no picture available.


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